4231 New Era v2

Based on the first version: https://fm-arena.com/thread/8409-4231-new-era/

Changelog TI:
Removed Overlaps on both sides

Changelog Player Roles:

WB (A) - FB (A)
PF(A) - AF

Changelog PIs:

Trimmed down most players instructions on the FBs
Added Dribble More on the REG
Removed Take More Risk on the AF

Was curious to try these changes, it feels like we lacked goals in the league compared to the other version but maybe that was due to some injuries etc so lets see how it does here.

Seems double RGA and FB works, ill take your idea ^^.

Congrats man, I hope on 4k tests you break 65 points

Nice one, pairing registas with FBs was insane. Unfortunnely we cant see any correlation with Arena benchmarking and the results you achived with City. I would have dumped this tactic in ur place, probably.

Delicious did this a long time ago looks like a copy

Lets see if this can survive the deadly 4k :P

letsgo9 said: Nice one, pairing registas with FBs was insane. Unfortunnely we cant see any correlation with Arena benchmarking and the results you achived with City. I would have dumped this tactic in ur place, probably. Expand

It felt to me that majority of the engine contribution is made in the wings like I saw @A Smile once saying and FB is the only role with Cross More Often enabled by default. Plus it offers better defensive cover than a regular WB.

I tried other versions even with WB with Cross More Often but it didnt really offer that much.

I feel like it could also be a bit RNG but lets see!

letsgo9 said: Nice one, pairing registas with FBs was insane. Unfortunnely we cant see any correlation with Arena benchmarking and the results you achived with City. I would have dumped this tactic in ur place, probably. Expand

Yes, very insane...




At least i am happy that the way i am building my test league ain't totaly wrong

Delicious said: Yes, very insane...
Expand

Jeez

Delicious said: Yes, very insane...



At least i am happy that the way i am building my test league ain't totaly wrong Expand

Thats insane, you prefer AM to SS normally? I tested AM even with mirror instructions to the IFs but it stalled a bit in these tests

juwow said: Thats insane, you prefer AM to SS normally? I tested AM even with mirror instructions to the IFs but it stalled a bit in these tests Expand

Hold on : https://www.deliciousfm.com/tacticlist/tactics/patch-me-24200/

I did test everything on 4231, results are different from Arena, i am using a different players build scenario.

I prefer SS as well to feed the lone Striker a bit more but results saying AM is tiny-mini-tiny better.


I will give to people a hint. Try WBs(A) with cross-more often if you want to check-out "your gamble's skills"

Delicious said: Hold on : https://www.deliciousfm.com/tacticlist/tactics/patch-me-24200/

I did test everything on 4231, results are different from Arena, i am using a different players build scenario.

I prefer SS as well to feed the lone Striker a bit more but results saying AM is tiny-mini-tiny better.


I will give to people a hint. Try WBs(A) with cross-more often if you want to check-out "your gamble's skills" Expand

Thanks my man, appreciate the feedback on the SS usage. Will also take a look at your stuff from the link you provided.

Keep posting here @Delicious, dont leave us!

@juwow what are the PIs for FBs? In some tests I did on the 24.1 version of the game, FBs did great and for a while I recommended it to others but I had some doubts in general when they had the ball compared to WBs.

dzek said: @juwow what are the PIs for FBs? In some tests I did on the 24.1 version of the game, FBs did great and for a while I recommended it to others but I had some doubts in general when they had the ball compared to WBs. Expand

The FBs have Shoot Less Often to disregard the random shots the AI does and Tackle Harder, pretty basic.

I feel like maybe in 3 CB formations the WB needs a bit more input to do his work but in this shape almost anything can work I believe

@Delicious if I could continue to pick your brain! What you think about Very Attacking mentality, I released another version with no focus play and Very Attacking and it felt better than Attacking atleast in this shape.

Would love to hear your thoughts if you could!

juwow said: The FBs have Shoot Less Often to disregard the random shots the AI does and Tackle Harder, pretty basic.

I feel like maybe in 3 CB formations the WB needs a bit more input to do his work but in this shape almost anything can work I believe Expand
I think the key on FB(a) is ‘Cross More Often’ as @Delicious also said. Low crossing on FM24 is very powerful.

dzek said: I think the key on FB(a) is ‘Cross More Often’ too as @Delicious also said. Low crossing on FM24 is very powerful. Expand

Look at this version: https://fm-arena.com/thread/8482-4231-new-era-iii/

I used what Delicious stated above with the WB cross more often combo did that and maybe like Delicious is saying its a bit of a dice roll however 3 Point Difference seems probably better to use FB

juwow said: @Delicious if I could continue to pick your brain! What you think about Very Attacking mentality, I released another version with no focus play and Very Attacking and it felt better than Attacking atleast in this shape.

Would love to hear your thoughts if you could! Expand

Very Attacking is just good to "all-in" situations, if you apply that to a specific corner routine, since you will get more.


dzek said: I think the key on FB(a) is ‘Cross More Often’ as @Delicious also said. Low crossing on FM24 is very powerful. Expand

-^ or maybe cross from byline is the malus.

Delicious said: Very Attacking is just good to "all-in" situations, if you apply that to a specific corner routine, since you will get more. Expand

What about for condition purposes? After a game the players seemed as tired as in Attacking Mentality but maybe cuz its City not sure

Using FBA is a good way to think about it, FBA is more robust minded, and FBA's default instructions have cross more often, which is a better fit under the current engine

juwow said: Look at this version: https://fm-arena.com/thread/8482-4231-new-era-iii/

I used what Delicious stated above with the WB cross more often combo did that and maybe like Delicious is saying its a bit of a dice roll however 3 Point Difference seems probably better to use FB Expand
That's why I said above when I tested them in my own tests they were more reliable in many parts of the game. Definitely a slight change though, it only has to do with the RNG. The goal is to find the weakness of ME, i.e. how your team builds up and how your team attacks, and try to use the right roles and team/player instructions to break it down.

FBs alone gave good results regardless of what roles were around them but that again we can find the best combination to maximize the effect.

Delicious said: -^ or maybe cross from byline is the malus. Expand
It could, but I think "Get Further Forward" does already a lot of work along with the team and player mentality.

juwow said: What about for condition purposes? After the a game the players seemed as tired as in Attacking Mentality but maybe cuz its City not sure Expand

If you check the EBFM's video you will understand that mentality has very little to do with "condition", it's more about training, gonna post a video about my thoughts on it soon.



juwow said: Look at this version: https://fm-arena.com/thread/8482-4231-new-era-iii/

I used what Delicious stated above with the WB cross more often combo did that and maybe like Delicious is saying its a bit of a dice roll however 3 Point Difference seems probably better to use FB Expand

Keep always in mind that RNG is there, i have countless of excel's data file with dropping or increasing of 3 points on 4k runs.

For example this is the "best" on my test league :



I can find you infinite trials with a "bad" run. So don't be too much focused on "3 points less", it's more "The tactic weren't lucky enough to cwin the gamble".


Later on gonna implement more data on my python_script, player's built are literally made by my "logic".

Delicious said: If you check the EBFM's video you will understand that mentality has very little to do with "condition", it's more about training, gonna post a video about my thoughts on it soon.





Keep always in mind that RNG is there, i have countless of excel's data file with dropping or increasing of 3 points on 4k runs.

For example this is the "best" on my test league :



I can find you infinite trials with a "bad" run. So don't be too much focused on "3 points less", it's more "The tactic weren't lucky enough to cwin the gamble".


Later on gonna implement more data on my python_script, player's built are literally made by my "logic". Expand

Perfect my man thanks for the info and I will search for this video on Ytube in regards to the condition to understand it a bit better!

Also I have seen now that you have your own test league so you got plenty of data to back you up which is what we all need to learn, glad that you can share such stats with us

so is SS better than AM? Would like to delve deeper into this

Anyone got Player instructions for this

dzek said: That's why I said above when I tested them in my own tests they were more reliable in many parts of the game. Definitely a slight change though, it only has to do with the RNG. The goal is to find the weakness of ME, i.e. how your team builds up and how your team attacks, and try to use the right roles and team/player instructions to break it down.

FBs alone gave good results regardless of what roles were around them but that again we can find the best combination to maximize the effect.


It could, but I think "Get Further Forward" does already a lot of work along with the team and player mentality. Expand

I can tell you, once i will start to run 8k runs or 12k. But literally at this point, to me 90% is a cosmetic scenario. And we just build a "puzzle" the tactic. PI/TI interaction is very strange.

At first i did believe it was like you said on FM23, that there was an hidden "multiplier" like pass into space + take more risk was rising it to 20 (example).

But literally they are the same thing on FM24. And not every role needs it. Even Hold up is doing something good. (Or maybe is another cosmetic feature, can't understand from the game, because i can't notice any difference).

But the CF(su) results are leading me to thinking the contrary.

The Beast said: Anyone got Player instructions for this Expand

There you go!

Delicious said: I can tell you, once i will start to run 8k runs or 12k. But literally at this point, to me 90% is a cosmetic scenario. And we just build a "puzzle" the tactic. PI/TI interaction is very strange.

At first i did believe it was like you said on FM23, that there was an hidden "multiplier" like pass into space + take more risk was rising it to 20 (example).

But literally they are the same thing on FM24. And not every role needs it. Even Hold up is doing something good. (Or maybe is another cosmetic feature, can't understand from the game, because i can't notice any difference).

But the CF(su) results are leading me to thinking the contrary. Expand

All top tactics seem to have Pass Into Space plus Run At Defense which we can attribute to Take More Risk and Dribble More in some way however when I am building (its just my theory and it can be completetly flawed) whenever I put a role in Attack I rarely add these PIs and I add instead to the ones that are on Support and Defense.

The ones that seem to be worth adding to every role depending on the shape is Roam From Position, Hold Up Ball and Move Into Channels in my opinion. The latter depending if there are players occupying the same half space of course.

juwow said: There you go! Expand

thanks mate