I won't be surprised if he's reached 10,000 number or something like that
Expand
I know Knap has 10000 different tactics, but the resemblance is just too much, just removing 1 TI and leaving everything else exactly the same and claiming it's your own, is not good
Why are you deleting the guy's message exposing the author of this thread using another tactician's tactic?
Shouldn't you be removing/warning the guy who is stealing a tactic from knap?
I'm sure if I uploaded the same shape as ZAZ fire, with the exact same instructions passing it off as my own, with no credit given to zaz you'd be quick to rip it down or issue a warning in no time as I've seen it done before.
I was the one who flagged it up to Jeff and it fucks things up if people are just going to steal other tacticians work then claim credit for it and then be ranked top tactic that it calls everything into question
My nice-words reply under ur previous post was deleted by admin. Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
Once once once again, can I ask u who u r? You seems to think highly of yourself, believing that FM Arena would shut down without you? Come on boy, the earth spins no matter u do or not do anything.
MakeSuRE said: My nice-words reply under ur previous post was deleted by admin. Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
Once once once again, can I ask u who u r? You seems to think highly of yourself, believing that FM Arena would shut down without you? Come on boy, the earth spins no matter u do or not do anything. Expand
I don't care if you make tactics good or not, but the moment you take like 99% of 1 tactic, change literally 1 thing alone and claiming to be yours, is something that is not done in my book.
At least give credit to the original creator if you copied, which you did.
And who I am, doesn't matter. I don't think highly of myself at all, but you clearly do, since you feel offended, which is good.
I also never said, that FM arena should be shut down, I'm saying that if this will be accepted, everyone can copy a tactic from someone and make literally 1 adjustment.
Jeffdekker said: I don't care if you make tactics good or not, but the moment you take like 99% of 1 tactic, change literally 1 thing alone and claiming to be yours, is something that is not done in my book. Expand
I've seen many times Knap taking successful tactics from here or other places then making few tweaks( even sometimes almost an exact copy) and not giving any credits... but of course, Knap is allowed to do so?
I don't think the guys from FM-Arena have time to investigate all tactics and similarities, and they rely on reports to check those things. That's why they are asking for suggestions on how to deal with the issue. I believe they don't plan to become a tribunal to judge who is copying who, or if the similarities are just coincidences. It's just unrealistic to think they would have the time for that. Bashing the website is pointless and rude.
Bogeyman said: I've seen many times Knap taking successful tactics from here or other places then making few tweaks( even sometimes almost an exact copy) and not giving any credits... but of course, Knap is allowed to do so? Expand
Name 1 tactic where this has happened?
I know for a fact if Knap actually copies a tactic, he gives credit to the author, so show me proof where he didn't.
MakeSuRE said: My nice-words reply under ur previous post was deleted by admin. Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
Once once once again, can I ask u who u r? You seems to think highly of yourself, believing that FM Arena would shut down without you? Come on boy, the earth spins no matter u do or not do anything. Expand
lmao you can't just use someone Elses tactic and then steal the glory making it out as your own and just pray no one notices then when called out ''say come on boy the earth still spins' lmao. give credit and call it a tweak.
Follow the standards of your username and ''MakeSuRe'' you avoid plagiarising
Metal said: Why are you deleting the guy's message exposing the author of this thread using another tactician's tactic?
Shouldn't you be removing/warning the guy who is stealing a tactic from knap?
I'm sure if I uploaded the same shape as ZAZ fire, with the exact same instructions passing it off as my own, with no credit given to zaz you'd be quick to rip it down or issue a warning in no time as I've seen it done before.
I was the one who flagged it up to Jeff and it fucks things up if people are just going to steal other tacticians work then claim credit for it and then be ranked top tactic that it calls everything into question Expand
WestHammer series were made in fm22 and I uploaded it here last year, and I remade it in fm23. It feels really weird to be charged with plagiarism once it is named on the ranking list. May I show u my vault of fake？
Bogeyman said: I've seen many times Knap taking successful tactics from here or other places then making few tweaks( even sometimes almost an exact copy) and not giving any credits... but of course, Knap is allowed to do so? Expand
You should call it out and show evidence of it then if he's copying an exact copy of someone elses tactic without giving credit
Standards should apply to everyone as people put a lot of time into creating and testing tactics, and its cheap to find out someone just copies it and presents it as their own.
Someone said few days ago that the FM community start to be poor and unpleasant.
I just see some people try to have the biggest d*** with a tactic from them or from nowhere.
Personnaly, i'll always use Zaz tactic because the indepth of all his post is far away from guys who just put a formation and 3 screenshots to say, Woaw, look at this i won the league with Man City !
Don't forget everyone is here to play the game as he like, there is no money to win if you're at the top of the table, especially if it's with another guy idea.
BTW, on FM-Gamers, my Forrest3412 got a highest rating among all the uploaded fm22's 3atb tactics , even better than Knap's ARGUS 352. Just be curious why I was not charged by anyone with plagiarism at that time?
there is a solution to all of this when you post a tactic just give knap the credit because sure as shit he has one the same in his encyclopedia thick book of tactics
Look, the discussion of plagiarism is nice and all, but it's not the type of matter that should be solved by fighting and making the issue public. My suggestion to handle those situations is to first contact the person with DM to make sure they know there is a similar tactic, and only if the issue is not solved people should bring it to the admins through the proper thread that was created. There is absolutely no need to bring issues to the admins if they can be solved with a simple DM to the user, which anyone can do.
MakeSuRE said: WestHammer series were made in fm22 and I uploaded it here last year, and I remade it in fm23. It feels really weird to be charged with plagiarism once it is named on the ranking list. May I show u my vault of fake？ Expand
Am I missing something, all those dates are from this year. Don't you think it's weird you have the exact same PI's and TI's same shape as this?
Jeffdekker said: I don't care if you make tactics good or not, but the moment you take like 99% of 1 tactic, change literally 1 thing alone and claiming to be yours, is something that is not done in my book.
At least give credit to the original creator if you copied, which you did.
And who I am, doesn't matter. I don't think highly of myself at all, but you clearly do, since you feel offended, which is good.
I also never said, that FM arena should be shut down, I'm saying that if this will be accepted, everyone can copy a tactic from someone and make literally 1 adjustment.
Give in and credit the original author mate. Expand
You have already sentenced me guilty. What's more would u like to hear from a criminal? One more question, does it feel good to dump shits on a stranger's head?
MakeSuRE said: You have already sentenced me guilty. What's more would u like to hear from a criminal? One more question, does it feel good to dump shits on a stranger's head? Expand
Cause you still haven't convinced me that you didn't copy him. I'm not dumping shits, I'm calling you out, big difference in that
Metal said: Am I missing something, all those dates are from this year. Don't you think it's weird you have the exact same PI's and TI's same shape as this?
Did knap stole your tactic? Expand
Do I have to make it clear that it is a folder of FM23? The very first version would be this one:fm arena The last version during fm22 period would be this one:fm gamers
TBH，u remind me of some guys who took my westhammer4231 so seriously last year, desperately trying to prove its fake.
Jeffdekker said: Cause you still haven't convinced me that you didn't copy him. I'm not dumping shits, I'm calling you out, big difference in that Expand
Go and ask ur neighbour to prove he/she is not alien.
I think part of the issue is that there is a relatively established "meta" which has carried over from FM22 in terms of team and player instructions. Even if you start with a clean slate I would imagine most people who post on this site have viewed which tactics tend to be successful and it is then very difficult to move away from instructions that have been proven to work. There are also a limited number of formations and roles to use and lots of people making tactics so there is bound to be some overlap with other tactics even when starting from scratch.
Knap does indeed produce a myriad of tactics so it is quite likely anything you make will resemble something he has posted. He also takes inspiration from this site - I noticed he began to post strikerless tactics after the success first shown on here in FM21 and his most recent team and player instructions have begun to more closely mimic those first seen on tactics posted here, with his own spin on the roles and duties. This isn't an attack on Knap at all by the way, I'm glad he does what he does, he's created a multitude of brilliant tactics which have helped loads of people to enjoy the FM series over the years, including myself.
At the end of the day let's just work together to try and create the best set of tactics we can for FM23 and as others have said, indicate where you have taken inspiration from another user. I don't think anyone here is posting for personal glory, rather to try and find out what works best in the game and I would hope anyone who does use another user's tactic as the base for their own would be honest enough to mention this in their write-up. If they don't and you strongly feel they have copied another tactic there is certainly a way to enquire politely via the admins or personal messages rather than firing accusations off straight off the bat.
Oblong999 said: Knap does indeed produce a myriad of tactics so it is quite likely anything you make will resemble something he has posted. He also takes inspiration from this site - I noticed he began to post strikerless tactics after the success first shown on here in FM21 and his most recent team and player instructions have begun to more closely mimic those first seen on tactics posted here, with his own spin on the roles and duties. This isn't an attack on Knap at all by the way, I'm glad he does what he does, he's created a multitude of brilliant tactics which have helped loads of people to enjoy the FM series over the years, including myself. Expand
That's what I was talking about.
Knap posted the exact copy of ZaZ's Blue tactic after ZaZ released but no one said a word...
Oblong999 said: there is certainly a way to enquire politely via the admins or personal messages rather than firing accusations off straight off the bat. Expand That the point which pissed me off.
Hello,
As discussed in https://fm-arena.com/thread/2707-please-help-us-to-establish-rules/#comment-15118
This tactic is clearly plagiarism: https://fm-arena.com/thread/2694-westhammer-4231dm-by-makesure/
This one is the same as https://community.sigames.com/forums/topic/451185-fm23-and-fm22_fm-21-fm-20-fm-19-recommended-tactic-list/page/567/#comment-13768858
Only difference this one has not Play out of defense in "In Possession"
Please remove this or let him credit Knap for this.
If no action will be taken, we can't take this site serious.
This is Knap making tactics
I won't be surprised if he's reached 10,000 number or something like that
Tsubasa said: This is Knap making tactics
I won't be surprised if he's reached 10,000 number or something like that
I know Knap has 10000 different tactics, but the resemblance is just too much, just removing 1 TI and leaving everything else exactly the same and claiming it's your own, is not good
Zippo said: The off topic has been removed.
@Jeffdekker, use a proper section for your issue.
Thank you.
Why are you deleting the guy's message exposing the author of this thread using another tactician's tactic?
Shouldn't you be removing/warning the guy who is stealing a tactic from knap?
I'm sure if I uploaded the same shape as ZAZ fire, with the exact same instructions passing it off as my own, with no credit given to zaz you'd be quick to rip it down or issue a warning in no time as I've seen it done before.
I was the one who flagged it up to Jeff and it fucks things up if people are just going to steal other tacticians work then claim credit for it and then be ranked top tactic that it calls everything into question
Metal said: Why are you deleting the guy's message exposing the author of this thread using another tactician's tactic?
because we have a specially designed place to solve such issues and this is the place
My nice-words reply under ur previous post was deleted by admin. Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
Once once once again, can I ask u who u r? You seems to think highly of yourself, believing that FM Arena would shut down without you? Come on boy, the earth spins no matter u do or not do anything.
MakeSuRE said: My nice-words reply under ur previous post was deleted by admin. Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
Once once once again, can I ask u who u r? You seems to think highly of yourself, believing that FM Arena would shut down without you? Come on boy, the earth spins no matter u do or not do anything.
I don't care if you make tactics good or not, but the moment you take like 99% of 1 tactic, change literally 1 thing alone and claiming to be yours, is something that is not done in my book.
At least give credit to the original creator if you copied, which you did.
And who I am, doesn't matter. I don't think highly of myself at all, but you clearly do, since you feel offended, which is good.
I also never said, that FM arena should be shut down, I'm saying that if this will be accepted, everyone can copy a tactic from someone and make literally 1 adjustment.
Give in and credit the original author mate.
MakeSuRE said: Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
unfortunately, I can't...
Jeffdekker said: I don't care if you make tactics good or not, but the moment you take like 99% of 1 tactic, change literally 1 thing alone and claiming to be yours, is something that is not done in my book.
I've seen many times Knap taking successful tactics from here or other places then making few tweaks( even sometimes almost an exact copy) and not giving any credits... but of course, Knap is allowed to do so?
I don't think the guys from FM-Arena have time to investigate all tactics and similarities, and they rely on reports to check those things. That's why they are asking for suggestions on how to deal with the issue. I believe they don't plan to become a tribunal to judge who is copying who, or if the similarities are just coincidences. It's just unrealistic to think they would have the time for that. Bashing the website is pointless and rude.
Bogeyman said: I've seen many times Knap taking successful tactics from here or other places then making few tweaks( even sometimes almost an exact copy) and not giving any credits... but of course, Knap is allowed to do so?
Name 1 tactic where this has happened?
I know for a fact if Knap actually copies a tactic, he gives credit to the author, so show me proof where he didn't.
MakeSuRE said: My nice-words reply under ur previous post was deleted by admin. Go and ask admin if he can show u what I told.
Once once once again, can I ask u who u r? You seems to think highly of yourself, believing that FM Arena would shut down without you? Come on boy, the earth spins no matter u do or not do anything.
lmao you can't just use someone Elses tactic and then steal the glory making it out as your own and just pray no one notices then when called out ''say come on boy the earth still spins' lmao. give credit and call it a tweak.
Follow the standards of your username and ''MakeSuRe'' you avoid plagiarising
Metal said: Why are you deleting the guy's message exposing the author of this thread using another tactician's tactic?
Shouldn't you be removing/warning the guy who is stealing a tactic from knap?
I'm sure if I uploaded the same shape as ZAZ fire, with the exact same instructions passing it off as my own, with no credit given to zaz you'd be quick to rip it down or issue a warning in no time as I've seen it done before.
I was the one who flagged it up to Jeff and it fucks things up if people are just going to steal other tacticians work then claim credit for it and then be ranked top tactic that it calls everything into question
WestHammer series were made in fm22 and I uploaded it here last year, and I remade it in fm23. It feels really weird to be charged with plagiarism once it is named on the ranking list.
May I show u my vault of fake？
Maybe it is a Newton-Leibniz formula story.
Bogeyman said: I've seen many times Knap taking successful tactics from here or other places then making few tweaks( even sometimes almost an exact copy) and not giving any credits... but of course, Knap is allowed to do so?
You should call it out and show evidence of it then if he's copying an exact copy of someone elses tactic without giving credit
Standards should apply to everyone as people put a lot of time into creating and testing tactics, and its cheap to find out someone just copies it and presents it as their own.
Jeffdekker said: Name 1 tactic where this has happened?
I know for a fact if Knap actually copies a tactic, he gives credit to the author, so show me proof where he didn't.
I'll do it if you pay for my spent time on it
It would required digging into my archive, I remember a lot of such cases.
For example, you could take ZaZ Blue 4.0 and find out that Knap posted the exact same tactic after ZaZ did it and he didn't give credit.
Someone said few days ago that the FM community start to be poor and unpleasant.
I just see some people try to have the biggest d*** with a tactic from them or from nowhere.
Personnaly, i'll always use Zaz tactic because the indepth of all his post is far away from guys who just put a formation and 3 screenshots to say, Woaw, look at this i won the league with Man City !
Don't forget everyone is here to play the game as he like, there is no money to win if you're at the top of the table, especially if it's with another guy idea.
Have nice saves guyz.
BTW, on FM-Gamers, my Forrest3412 got a highest rating among all the uploaded fm22's 3atb tactics , even better than Knap's ARGUS 352. Just be curious why I was not charged by anyone with plagiarism at that time?
there is a solution to all of this when you post a tactic just give knap the credit because sure as shit he has one the same in his encyclopedia thick book of tactics
Look, the discussion of plagiarism is nice and all, but it's not the type of matter that should be solved by fighting and making the issue public. My suggestion to handle those situations is to first contact the person with DM to make sure they know there is a similar tactic, and only if the issue is not solved people should bring it to the admins through the proper thread that was created. There is absolutely no need to bring issues to the admins if they can be solved with a simple DM to the user, which anyone can do.
MakeSuRE said: WestHammer series were made in fm22 and I uploaded it here last year, and I remade it in fm23. It feels really weird to be charged with plagiarism once it is named on the ranking list.
May I show u my vault of fake？
Am I missing something, all those dates are from this year. Don't you think it's weird you have the exact same PI's and TI's same shape as this?
Did knap stole your tactic?
Jeffdekker said: I don't care if you make tactics good or not, but the moment you take like 99% of 1 tactic, change literally 1 thing alone and claiming to be yours, is something that is not done in my book.
At least give credit to the original creator if you copied, which you did.
And who I am, doesn't matter. I don't think highly of myself at all, but you clearly do, since you feel offended, which is good.
I also never said, that FM arena should be shut down, I'm saying that if this will be accepted, everyone can copy a tactic from someone and make literally 1 adjustment.
Give in and credit the original author mate.
You have already sentenced me guilty. What's more would u like to hear from a criminal?
One more question, does it feel good to dump shits on a stranger's head?
MakeSuRE said: You have already sentenced me guilty. What's more would u like to hear from a criminal?
One more question, does it feel good to dump shits on a stranger's head?
Cause you still haven't convinced me that you didn't copy him.
I'm not dumping shits, I'm calling you out, big difference in that
Metal said: Am I missing something, all those dates are from this year. Don't you think it's weird you have the exact same PI's and TI's same shape as this?
Did knap stole your tactic?
Do I have to make it clear that it is a folder of FM23?
The very first version would be this one:fm arena
The last version during fm22 period would be this one:fm gamers
TBH，u remind me of some guys who took my westhammer4231 so seriously last year, desperately trying to prove its fake.
Jeffdekker said: Cause you still haven't convinced me that you didn't copy him.
I'm not dumping shits, I'm calling you out, big difference in that
Go and ask ur neighbour to prove he/she is not alien.
I think part of the issue is that there is a relatively established "meta" which has carried over from FM22 in terms of team and player instructions. Even if you start with a clean slate I would imagine most people who post on this site have viewed which tactics tend to be successful and it is then very difficult to move away from instructions that have been proven to work. There are also a limited number of formations and roles to use and lots of people making tactics so there is bound to be some overlap with other tactics even when starting from scratch.
Knap does indeed produce a myriad of tactics so it is quite likely anything you make will resemble something he has posted. He also takes inspiration from this site - I noticed he began to post strikerless tactics after the success first shown on here in FM21 and his most recent team and player instructions have begun to more closely mimic those first seen on tactics posted here, with his own spin on the roles and duties. This isn't an attack on Knap at all by the way, I'm glad he does what he does, he's created a multitude of brilliant tactics which have helped loads of people to enjoy the FM series over the years, including myself.
At the end of the day let's just work together to try and create the best set of tactics we can for FM23 and as others have said, indicate where you have taken inspiration from another user. I don't think anyone here is posting for personal glory, rather to try and find out what works best in the game and I would hope anyone who does use another user's tactic as the base for their own would be honest enough to mention this in their write-up. If they don't and you strongly feel they have copied another tactic there is certainly a way to enquire politely via the admins or personal messages rather than firing accusations off straight off the bat.
Happy tinkering all.
Oblong999 said: Knap does indeed produce a myriad of tactics so it is quite likely anything you make will resemble something he has posted. He also takes inspiration from this site - I noticed he began to post strikerless tactics after the success first shown on here in FM21 and his most recent team and player instructions have begun to more closely mimic those first seen on tactics posted here, with his own spin on the roles and duties. This isn't an attack on Knap at all by the way, I'm glad he does what he does, he's created a multitude of brilliant tactics which have helped loads of people to enjoy the FM series over the years, including myself.
That's what I was talking about.
Knap posted the exact copy of ZaZ's Blue tactic after ZaZ released but no one said a word...
Oblong999 said: there is certainly a way to enquire politely via the admins or personal messages rather than firing accusations off straight off the bat.
That the point which pissed me off.
Bogeyman said: That's what I was talking about.
Knap posted the exact copy of ZaZ's Blue tactic after ZaZ released but no one said a word...
I did say something and spoke with knap directly about it at the time as but then he said he made the tactic before with warrior years ago
Metal said: I did say something and spoke with knap directly about it
at least it's good to know that someone said something...
Metal said: but then he said he made the tactic before with warrior years ago
ok, show me that tactic he created years ago... I want to see it.