this is why i dont like sites where knap is involved he spams the site with 1 million tactics and has his toxic followers beating down on anyone who gets close to his tactics what im really trying to say jeffdekker is piss off with your toxic shit back to knap before you get decked people are tired of you
rego8 said: this is why i dont like sites where knap is involved he spams the site with 1 million tactics and has his toxic followers beating down on anyone who gets close to his tactics what im really trying to say jeffdekker is piss off with your toxic shit back to knap before you get decked people are tired of you Expand
Funny how you call me toxic, while you are the one being toxic now, for saying I'm getting "decked"
Since when is having a different opinion being toxic? I'm not a "Follower" nor am I "Toxic".
And so what, you're gonna deck me? Better make up to your promise there, instead of only barking.
ZaZ said: I'm not going to bring Knap to the discussion, I respect the contribution he brings to the community.
About your complaints with results, I have uploaded my tactics to multiple places, and it just happened to be first here. There is nothing more to it. Different tests have different methodologies, which lead to different outcomes. You can even download the results from those testing places and check it yourself. I always answer everyone that talks to me in any of those places, it just happens that people talk more here because my tactic is better on the table. Expand
Ahum, so me calling out on your tactics only being top here, is complaining? Strange world we live in.
I'm only questioning those results, I'm not complaining. The fact that you are taking it as complaining, says more about you than about me.
rego8 said: this is why i dont like sites where knap is involved he spams the site with 1 million tactics and has his toxic followers beating down on anyone who gets close to his tactics what im really trying to say jeffdekker is piss off with your toxic shit back to knap before you get decked people are tired of you Expand
Who's tired of him? He's been here just over a day, so how can you talk on behalf of everyone on the forum?
There are no followers, I've explained there are people plagiarising other people's work and it's not just knap tactics but youtubers as well. They're all getting called out, so stop the victim bullshit.
If the tactic looks the same, with the same team instructions, same formation shape, same player instructions and only one or two things changed, then somebody is using another person's work and passing it as their own which deserves taking down.
Since it happens to be the no 1 tactic on this site, it's going to get attention and when I was sent the knap tactic before this westhammer was released I noticed everything was the same. So what is the chance of someone creating the exact same tactic with one guy being somewhere in asia and some guy in Europe?
Metal said: Who's tired of him? He's been here just over a day, so how can you talk on behalf of everyone on the forum?
There are no followers, I've explained there are people plagiarising other people's work and it's not just knap tactics but youtubers as well. They're all getting called out, so stop the victim bullshit.
If the tactic looks the same, with the same team instructions, same formation shape, same player instructions and only one or two things changed, then somebody is using another person's work and passing it as their own which deserves taking down.
Since it happens to be the no 1 tactic on this site, it's going to get attention and when I was sent the knap tactic before this westhammer was released I noticed everything was the same. So what is the chance of someone creating the exact same tactic with one guy being somewhere in asia and some guy in Europe? Expand
knap lover i didnt say the forum is tired of him i said people
rego8 said: knap lover i didnt say the forum is tired of him i said people Expand
Where are these people? They are on the forum you fool, so you are speaking for others, and now threatening violence all because someone called out a plagiariser.
You're making a mess of yourself; you should just log off right now.
Jeffdekker said: Ahum, so me calling out on your tactics only being top here, is complaining? Strange world we live in.
I'm only questioning those results, I'm not complaining. The fact that you are taking it as complaining, says more about you than about me. Expand
I'm not going to argue with you. If you think my tactics are bad, it's fine. If you don't trust the results from FM-Arena, it's fine too. The fact that you don't understand that results can be different depending on the testing league says more about you than about me.
ZaZ said: I'm not going to argue with you. If you think my tactics are bad, it's fine. If you don't trust the results from FM-Arena, it's fine too. The fact that you don't understand that results can be different depending on the testing league says more about you than about me. Expand
Who says we have to argue? You're the one saying I'm "Complaining" and wanting to "Argue"
Yet I'm just calling your results out.
If the tactic is that good, the results on each testing league should be the same.
rego8 said: id do it with ease 1 round is all i would need pm where you want to meet if your up to it Expand
I can even public give you even my personal andress but i live in Italy so you gonna pay for your tickets Don't act like you are worth more then 10 seconds because you can't argue or gives a clearly point. I am ready to get decked whenever you want, but sometimes before doing this kind of statement you should process your 4 working neurons inside the thing called skull.
The funny thing about all of this pillar of infinite shit is : One guy got humiliated in public by a post made of an admin, and the tones weren't like that,don't you think that was fishy?
You know what's the different? Axel's decided to drop-off istantly and Makesure didn't.
And i respect that Makesure defended his self,because if i work 300 hours on something,but coming up that is similar to another work of someone else why tho it should be called plagiarism? But since this is something "similar" to a Knap's tactic the tone are differents, if it was zaz's business even the admin would come out, pointing out that "oh hey those things are so similar", so what we gonna do? To you that's the normal way right?
If someone brings out again that i am doing cospiracy,i will start doing it like a live-piston. Since i am the only one here basing things on public-forum fact,since i don't know what happened on back-end.
If this site atleast tries to test tactics provided to them in the correct way Expand
no one forces people to upload their tactics on this site and no one forces them to believe in the test result and no one's going to convince you of anything, if you don't trust then move along and end of the story
Chewbacca said: no one forces people to upload their tactics on this site and no one forces them to believe in the test result and no one's going to convince you of anything, if you don't trust then move along and end of the story Expand
I never said, that people should be forced to upload. Nor do I say to believe in the test results.
Can we not all agree to disagree, you guys are arguing over and over again and over a game at the end of the day. Clearly everyones view and opinions on this topic are set in stone and wont change and also threats and insults are not ways to try convince someone of your viewpoint or if you believe they did something wrong as instead of the issues being addressed or any middle ground being come to this thread has turned into a bunch of high school level insults being thrown back and forth and a toxic culture brewing thanks to it.
MakeSuRE said: You quoted so I have to answer whatever you asked? Sorry I am a poor blind man so I only see what makes me uncomfortable, especially not in my native language. In fact, I don't care all the stuffs you guys went through these two days. I just make, test and adjust what I like to show in the game panel. If someone wants the 1st place, just go and get it. Putting yourself into my position, what would you do to deal with these wildly arrogant burglars? Tell me the necessity that why I have to protest my innocence after being treated in this way? Expand
Sorry i didn't see that,i don't even know the whole story,to me you did the right thing even if you're the culpirt. I am just so sad that Axel didn't put a fight on his case as well. I personally don't care if you did or not, if you worked, if you got a "real" ispiration, or studied everything that could fit in the tactic to make it work. You just failed to understand that i was sarcasting around to hear the "story" but seem half of the people here don't even read a full sentence so it's ok!
Btw it was some under lines that i stated that i was trolling.
Pumpkin said: Can we not all agree to disagree, you guys are arguing over and over again and over a game at the end of the day. Clearly everyones view and opinions on this topic are set in stone and wont change and also threats and insults are not ways to try convince someone of your viewpoint or if you believe they did something wrong as instead of the issues being addressed or any middle ground being come to this thread has turned into a bunch of high school level insults being thrown back and forth and a toxic culture brewing thanks to it. Expand
Well there is no real debate to be had. Knap released a tactic on 23rd of October and 4 days later MakeSure manages to produce the exact same replica of player and team instructions.
What middle ground should we take, that we should be allowed to use eachothers tactics claim it as our own, and have it tested?
I might just do that and if anyone wants to flag me about it, they can be directed to this thread and I expect it to get tested.
Metal said: Well there is no real debate to be had. Knap released a tactic on 23rd of October and 4 days later MakeSure manages to produce the exact same replica of player and team instructions. Expand
Ok, if we want to refrain from double standards in our approach then you have to explain me this
On 2nd February, @ZaZ released his "ZaZ - Blue 3.2 AW" tactic, which topped the table.
Jeffdekker said: Funny you say this, we addressed this to Knap. And hey look:
FM21, 2021.
So basically we can say, doesn't mean we will, Zaz took this inspiration from Knap.
Got anything to say for that? Expand
The tactics aren't the same.
If you want I can't find you like a hundred similar looking tactic from FM21 and FM20.
The thing is, the game hasn't changed for many years and if you take any FM23 tactic then you can find a very similar tactic from FM19 or FM20 or FM21 or FM22.
At this point we really already seen everything when it comes to the tactics in FM and there just can't be anything new.
If you want I can't find you like a hundred similar looking tactic from FM21 and FM20.
The thing is, the game hasn't changed for many years and if you take any FM23 tactic then you can find a very similar tactic from FM19 or FM20 or FM21 or FM22. Expand
Aren't the same? Formation is the same, gods given instead of a DM it's a CM, the shape is the same.
Sandro said: At this point we really already seen everything when it comes to the tactics in FM and there just can't be anything new. Expand
So basically you're justifying people can copy other people their work and claim to be their own?
Jeff just showed he's been using that shape years before zaz cooked up the zaz blue, so you just shot yourself in the foot
Madasahatter has been around since fm21 and anyone the instructions are different with zaz using less tactica instructions and pulling the dlp into a rpm role.
The tactic MaKeSure made, is an exact replica of knap tactic with the exact same instructions, where I think only the set pieces have been changed.
I'll be loading a tactic very soon on here and I hope you guys enjoy, it better be tested and I don't want to hear anyone cry to me about credits
this is why i dont like sites where knap is involved he spams the site with 1 million tactics and has his toxic followers beating down on anyone who gets close to his tactics
what im really trying to say jeffdekker is piss off with your toxic shit back to knap before you get decked people are tired of you
rego8 said: this is why i dont like sites where knap is involved he spams the site with 1 million tactics and has his toxic followers beating down on anyone who gets close to his tactics
what im really trying to say jeffdekker is piss off with your toxic shit back to knap before you get decked people are tired of you
Funny how you call me toxic, while you are the one being toxic now, for saying I'm getting "decked"
Since when is having a different opinion being toxic?
I'm not a "Follower" nor am I "Toxic".
And so what, you're gonna deck me?
Better make up to your promise there, instead of only barking.
ZaZ said: I'm not going to bring Knap to the discussion, I respect the contribution he brings to the community.
About your complaints with results, I have uploaded my tactics to multiple places, and it just happened to be first here. There is nothing more to it. Different tests have different methodologies, which lead to different outcomes. You can even download the results from those testing places and check it yourself. I always answer everyone that talks to me in any of those places, it just happens that people talk more here because my tactic is better on the table.
Ahum, so me calling out on your tactics only being top here, is complaining?
Strange world we live in.
I'm only questioning those results, I'm not complaining.
The fact that you are taking it as complaining, says more about you than about me.
rego8 said: this is why i dont like sites where knap is involved he spams the site with 1 million tactics and has his toxic followers beating down on anyone who gets close to his tactics
what im really trying to say jeffdekker is piss off with your toxic shit back to knap before you get decked people are tired of you
Who's tired of him? He's been here just over a day, so how can you talk on behalf of everyone on the forum?
There are no followers, I've explained there are people plagiarising other people's work and it's not just knap tactics but youtubers as well. They're all getting called out, so stop the victim bullshit.
If the tactic looks the same, with the same team instructions, same formation shape, same player instructions and only one or two things changed, then somebody is using another person's work and passing it as their own which deserves taking down.
Since it happens to be the no 1 tactic on this site, it's going to get attention and when I was sent the knap tactic before this westhammer was released I noticed everything was the same. So what is the chance of someone creating the exact same tactic with one guy being somewhere in asia and some guy in Europe?
Metal said: Who's tired of him? He's been here just over a day, so how can you talk on behalf of everyone on the forum?
There are no followers, I've explained there are people plagiarising other people's work and it's not just knap tactics but youtubers as well. They're all getting called out, so stop the victim bullshit.
If the tactic looks the same, with the same team instructions, same formation shape, same player instructions and only one or two things changed, then somebody is using another person's work and passing it as their own which deserves taking down.
Since it happens to be the no 1 tactic on this site, it's going to get attention and when I was sent the knap tactic before this westhammer was released I noticed everything was the same. So what is the chance of someone creating the exact same tactic with one guy being somewhere in asia and some guy in Europe?
knap lover i didnt say the forum is tired of him i said people
rego8 said: knap lover i didnt say the forum is tired of him i said people
Where are these people? They are on the forum you fool, so you are speaking for others, and now threatening violence all because someone called out a plagiariser.
You're making a mess of yourself; you should just log off right now.
Jeffdekker said: Ahum, so me calling out on your tactics only being top here, is complaining?
Strange world we live in.
I'm only questioning those results, I'm not complaining.
The fact that you are taking it as complaining, says more about you than about me.
I'm not going to argue with you. If you think my tactics are bad, it's fine. If you don't trust the results from FM-Arena, it's fine too. The fact that you don't understand that results can be different depending on the testing league says more about you than about me.
ZaZ said: I'm not going to argue with you. If you think my tactics are bad, it's fine. If you don't trust the results from FM-Arena, it's fine too. The fact that you don't understand that results can be different depending on the testing league says more about you than about me.
Who says we have to argue?
You're the one saying I'm "Complaining" and wanting to "Argue"
Yet I'm just calling your results out.
If the tactic is that good, the results on each testing league should be the same.
Jeffdekker said: If the tactic is that good, the results on each testing league should be the same.
That's not how games based on random events work.
ZaZ said: That's not how games based on random events work.
It is though.
I've seen many tactics perform the same over 3 testing leagues, yet others not.
Care to elaborate?
Jeffdekker said: It is though.
I've seen many tactics perform the same over 3 testing leagues, yet others not.
Care to elaborate?
those are empty words
give links I want to check it
rego8 said: id do it with ease 1 round is all i would need pm where you want to meet if your up to it
I can even public give you even my personal andress but i live in Italy so you gonna pay for your tickets
Don't act like you are worth more then 10 seconds because you can't argue or gives a clearly point.
I am ready to get decked whenever you want, but sometimes before doing this kind of statement you should process your 4 working neurons inside the thing called skull.
The funny thing about all of this pillar of infinite shit is : One guy got humiliated in public by a post made of an admin, and the tones weren't like that,don't you think that was fishy?
You know what's the different? Axel's decided to drop-off istantly and Makesure didn't.
And i respect that Makesure defended his self,because if i work 300 hours on something,but coming up that is similar to another work of someone else why tho it should be called plagiarism?
But since this is something "similar" to a Knap's tactic the tone are differents, if it was zaz's business even the admin would come out, pointing out that "oh hey those things are so similar", so what we gonna do? To you that's the normal way right?
If someone brings out again that i am doing cospiracy,i will start doing it like a live-piston.
Since i am the only one here basing things on public-forum fact,since i don't know what happened on back-end.
Chewbacca said: those are empty words
give links I want to check it
Ever heard of Google?
Not many sites started testing yet on FM23, when they do, I'll show you
Jeffdekker said: Ever heard of Google?
Not many sites started testing yet on FM23, when they do, I'll show you
then we'll talk about that when you have facts on your hands and not just empty words
Chewbacca said: then we'll talk about that when you have facts on your hands and not just empty words
Sure no worries.
If this site atleast tries to test tactics provided to them in the correct way
Jeffdekker said: Sure no worries.
If this site atleast tries to test tactics provided to them in the correct way
no one forces people to upload their tactics on this site and no one forces them to believe in the test result and no one's going to convince you of anything, if you don't trust then move along and end of the story
Chewbacca said: no one forces people to upload their tactics on this site and no one forces them to believe in the test result and no one's going to convince you of anything, if you don't trust then move along and end of the story
I never said, that people should be forced to upload.
Nor do I say to believe in the test results.
Can we not all agree to disagree, you guys are arguing over and over again and over a game at the end of the day. Clearly everyones view and opinions on this topic are set in stone and wont change and also threats and insults are not ways to try convince someone of your viewpoint or if you believe they did something wrong as instead of the issues being addressed or any middle ground being come to this thread has turned into a bunch of high school level insults being thrown back and forth and a toxic culture brewing thanks to it.
MakeSuRE said: You quoted so I have to answer whatever you asked? Sorry I am a poor blind man so I only see what makes me uncomfortable, especially not in my native language.
In fact, I don't care all the stuffs you guys went through these two days. I just make, test and adjust what I like to show in the game panel. If someone wants the 1st place, just go and get it.
Putting yourself into my position, what would you do to deal with these wildly arrogant burglars? Tell me the necessity that why I have to protest my innocence after being treated in this way?
Sorry i didn't see that,i don't even know the whole story,to me you did the right thing even if you're the culpirt. I am just so sad that Axel didn't put a fight on his case as well.
I personally don't care if you did or not, if you worked, if you got a "real" ispiration, or studied everything that could fit in the tactic to make it work.
You just failed to understand that i was sarcasting around to hear the "story" but seem half of the people here don't even read a full sentence so it's ok!
Btw it was some under lines that i stated that i was trolling.
Jeffdekker said: It is though.
I've seen many tactics perform the same over 3 testing leagues, yet others not.
Care to elaborate?
I don't need to elaborate. It's called statistics, and it's not rocket science.
Pumpkin said: Can we not all agree to disagree, you guys are arguing over and over again and over a game at the end of the day. Clearly everyones view and opinions on this topic are set in stone and wont change and also threats and insults are not ways to try convince someone of your viewpoint or if you believe they did something wrong as instead of the issues being addressed or any middle ground being come to this thread has turned into a bunch of high school level insults being thrown back and forth and a toxic culture brewing thanks to it.
Well there is no real debate to be had. Knap released a tactic on 23rd of October and 4 days later MakeSure manages to produce the exact same replica of player and team instructions.
What middle ground should we take, that we should be allowed to use eachothers tactics claim it as our own, and have it tested?
I might just do that and if anyone wants to flag me about it, they can be directed to this thread and I expect it to get tested.
Metal said: Well there is no real debate to be had. Knap released a tactic on 23rd of October and 4 days later MakeSure manages to produce the exact same replica of player and team instructions.
Ok, if we want to refrain from double standards in our approach then you have to explain me this
On 2nd February, @ZaZ released his "ZaZ - Blue 3.2 AW" tactic, which topped the table.
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2573-zaz-blue-3-2-aw/
then 3 days later on 5th February Knap released his Warrior tactic that looked very similar to ZaZ's Blue tactic
and on 9th May, Knap released another tactic that looked almost exactly like ZaZ's Blue tactic
I really don't see that Knap giving ZaZ any credit.
What do you think about it?
P.S. also, look at this FM22 tactic by Johnsariman... don't you find any similarities?
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2703-the-airplane-by-johnsariman-v3-blue-tweak/
Sandro said: Ok, if we want to refrain from double standards in our approach then you have to explain me this
On 2nd February, @ZaZ released his "ZaZ - Blue 3.2 AW" tactic, which topped the table.
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2573-zaz-blue-3-2-aw/
then 3 days later on 5th February Knap released his Warrior tactic that looked very similar to ZaZ's Blue tactic
and on 9th May, Knap released another tactic that looked almost exactly like ZaZ's Blue tactic
I really don't see that Knap giving ZaZ any credit.
What do you think about it?
P.S. also, look at this FM22 tactic by Johnsariman... don't you find any similarities?
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2703-the-airplane-by-johnsariman-v3-blue-tweak/
Funny you say this, we addressed this to Knap.
And hey look:
FM21, 2021.
So basically we can say, doesn't mean we will, Zaz took this inspiration from Knap.
Got anything to say for that?
Jeffdekker said: Funny you say this, we addressed this to Knap.
And hey look:
FM21, 2021.
So basically we can say, doesn't mean we will, Zaz took this inspiration from Knap.
Got anything to say for that?
The tactics aren't the same.
If you want I can't find you like a hundred similar looking tactic from FM21 and FM20.
The thing is, the game hasn't changed for many years and if you take any FM23 tactic then you can find a very similar tactic from FM19 or FM20 or FM21 or FM22.
At this point we really already seen everything when it comes to the tactics in FM and there just can't be anything new.
Sandro said: The tactics aren't the same.
If you want I can't find you like a hundred similar looking tactic from FM21 and FM20.
The thing is, the game hasn't changed for many years and if you take any FM23 tactic then you can find a very similar tactic from FM19 or FM20 or FM21 or FM22.
Aren't the same?
Formation is the same, gods given instead of a DM it's a CM, the shape is the same.
Sandro said: At this point we really already seen everything when it comes to the tactics in FM and there just can't be anything new.
So basically you're justifying people can copy other people their work and claim to be their own?
Interesting.
Sandro said: Ok, if we want to refrain from double standards in our approach then you have to explain me this
On 2nd February, @ZaZ released his "ZaZ - Blue 3.2 AW" tactic, which topped the table.
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2573-zaz-blue-3-2-aw/
then 3 days later on 5th February Knap released his Warrior tactic that looked very similar to ZaZ's Blue tactic
and on 9th May, Knap released another tactic that looked almost exactly like ZaZ's Blue tactic
I really don't see that Knap giving ZaZ any credit.
What do you think about it?
P.S. also, look at this FM22 tactic by Johnsariman... don't you find any similarities?
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2703-the-airplane-by-johnsariman-v3-blue-tweak/
Jeff just showed he's been using that shape years before zaz cooked up the zaz blue, so you just shot yourself in the foot
Madasahatter has been around since fm21 and anyone the instructions are different with zaz using less tactica instructions and pulling the dlp into a rpm role.
The tactic MaKeSure made, is an exact replica of knap tactic with the exact same instructions, where I think only the set pieces have been changed.
I'll be loading a tactic very soon on here and I hope you guys enjoy, it better be tested and I don't want to hear anyone cry to me about credits
Jeffdekker said: Aren't the same?
Formation is the same
The formation isn't the same, there's CM position instead of DM position.
Jeffdekker said: So basically you're justifying people can copy other people their work and claim to be their own?
Interesting.
I'm just saying that at this point you just can't post anything and not being in plagiarism
Sandro said: The formation isn't the same, there's CM position instead of DM position.
Did I say formation? No.
Did I show the shape? Yes
Inspiration is clearly taken from Knap.
Even in 2019 he already made a tactic with the same shape.
You're doing a bad job of deflecting something.
Next time please read what Im actually saying
I've closed this thread and later I'll clean it up from personal insults.
The sides had a chance to represent their arguments.
This case has been discussed enough for the FM community make their mind up on it.
I want to warn you if someone try to bring it up again then he'll be banned.
Cheers.