Also note, in FM-Arena testing the difference between "Poatan 451" tactic and "424 Alhamdulillah II 0.8" tactic is "18" points.
But in this test:
In the Round #1 the difference between tactics is "14" points.
In the Round #2 the difference between tactics is "9" points.
In the Round #3 the difference between tactics is "7" points.
The above result means that the stronger/weaker your team comparing with your opponents, the smaller role the tactic plays.
So testing tactics with a team that is much stronger or weaker than other teams in league isn't a good idea because such testing would be very ineffective.
Also, the result of this test shows that if you build a "Dream Team" with players like Mbappe, Messi, Neymar and similar best players then the quality of your tactic would become kinda irrelevant
MemorizableUsername said: Edit : Or maybe test using a similar 4-2-4 tactic that scored 58,56,54 on the testing table to see how much we need to upgrade players to be champions Expand
Jamal Lowe was given Natural rating for CM position so it was possible to test both tactics with the same players.
There wasn't any player rotation. The same starting eleven were used to play all matches. The morale and conditions of the players were locked at 100%, which also was done for the AI teams.
The testing conditions were the same for both tests.
ROUND #1: Default Attributes In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 122
ROUND #2: +2 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 142
ROUND #3: +3 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Wish said: Stop also accepting this kind of name for tactics, show common sense for soccer fans, we are not here to suffer proselytizing. Expand Once more, if you have any issues or complains then instead of calling out people and starting public brawls, you should contact the administration via private messages or email. Otherwise the only what you achieve is getting yourself into troubles.
Tomaka said: @Zippo Pinging you in case it was missed that Fudge's main post was updated with information a few days ago. Interested to see how it does Expand
I'm sure many of you, just like me, have wondered whether it's possible to win English Premier League managing one of the weakest team in the league or how long would it take to achieve that.
So I've done a test to find out it. I picked Bournemouth, one of the weakest team in the league that was predicted to finish 20th.
The 7 important attributes chosen for the increasing were: Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling.
ROUND #1: Default Attributes In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches Average CA = 122
ROUND #2: +2 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches Average CA = 142
ROUND #3: +3 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches Average CA = 149
As you can see winning EPL with the default Bournemouth team is a quite difficult task because the team gets only about 64 points on average per season when Man City and Liverpool get 85-90 points on average per season. I'd say winning the EPL with the default Bournemouth team is still possible but you need to be very lucky to do that, I mean your team must have the best season, far better than its average season and Man City and Liverpool must have the worst season, much worse than their average season.
When the Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling attributes of the players get 2 points increase then the team start getting about 85-87 points on average per season so wining EPL becomes a much easier task but still winning EPL isn't assured because if you have your worst season and Man City and Liverpool have their best season then highly likely they win the league.
Finally, when the Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling attributes of the players get 3 points increase then the team starts getting 92-95 points on average per season, which further increases the chances of winning the EPL, it becomes almost assured.
I just wanted to demonstrate you how the game works, as you can see it isn't only about having the best tactic but also about having the best players. You can spend months on improving your tactic to improve the result by 1 point or you can increase 7 attributes of the players by 3 points and that would improve the result by about 30 points from 64 points to 94 points.
Also, look at the CA of the players in the Round 3, it's only about 150CA, which means it's still possible to get much better players with 160CA-180CA and further greatly improve the result but also, note that to have a solid chances of winning EPL it requires having at least 150CA players.
Hirdious said: I've seen some issues with the previous system not picking up tactics Expand
No, there're other reasons for that decision.
Yes, tactic are being added manually in the queue but don't worry we make sure that all uploaded tactics are reviewed and If some your tactics weren't picked for the testing then there was only one reason for that, they didn't meet the requirements - https://fm-arena.com/thread/2733-how-fm-arena-picks-tactics-for-the-testing/
It's a known fact that many people play the game or test tactics using "Go On Vacation/Holiday" approach but the full game version isn't supposed to be played like that, I'll explain what I mean.
From time to time players come to you with various concerns and issues, it looks like this:
They also get "Concerned" status in their "Player Status"
If you don't talk to players within few days after they became "Concerned" then they automatically turn "Unhappy", which means they are mad at you and might not talk to you for few weeks or months, all that time their Morale will be very poor:
Usually, many other players in the team start to support "Unhappy" players and also get a poor Morale.
IMPORTANT: If you think that your assistant manager handles the issues with players when you go on "Holiday/Vacation" then you're wrong because he doesn't do that ( the game doesn't have such mechanics ).
Also, it's important to understand that when you go on Holiday/Vacation then your assistant manager handles these important things:
- Assistant Manager does the team talks - Assistant Manager picks players for the starting eleven - Assistant Manager rotates the team - Assistant Manager does substitutions
And if your assistant manager has poor attributes for handling these important things then the result will be much worse than they could be.
That's why it's very important to "Freeze" the morale and conditions with FMRTE when you test tactics.
Also, it's important to understand that playing/testing on "Holiday/Vacation" might produce much worse result than playing the game in normal way.
ZaZ said: I just wonder if it's better to have neutral WB and IF, or if they are better both wide to stretch the field away from midfield (in a context without overlap team instruction). Expand If you look at the result of this test - https://fm-arena.com/thread/2899-width/
then you'll see that there's almost no difference between the minimal value and the maximal value of the width setting.
Of course, for a different formation with different roles, duties, TIs the result might be different but I don't think there'll be much difference.
Anyway, if someone's gonna test different combinations of the Width setting for the wingers and fullback then obviously, it must be done without the "Overlap" TI because it might override the width settings of the wingers and fullbacks.
ZaZ said: Well, I changed only two things in my updated Water, and the decrease in quality was noticeable (still in the limit of RNG, but still a big decrease). Since I don't think the cause was shorter passing, I assume it's the narrow for WB. The only changes were those two. Expand
I just want to be clear my knowledge about how the overlap TI works is from the devs BUT it might be outdated because it was the previous FM versions and they might change the way it works for FM23.
BUT still I think it's useful to know how it worked before ( it still might work the same right now ).
I've been noticing that an intensive testing of different width combinations for wingers and fullbacks happens here.
So I just want to share with you my thoughts and experience about it.
First of all, in order overlap runs happen the wingers must sit narrower than the fullbacks otherwise overlap runs won't happen.
And I'm almost sure that when you add "Overlap Left" TI and "Overlap Right" TI then this happens:
- the wingers get their width setting set at "Narrow"
- the fullbacks get their width setting set at "Wide"
- the wingers get their "Forward Runs" setting reduced
- the fullbacks get their "Forward Runs" setting increased
(some other things might happen under the hood)
As we know, TIs override PIs, which means if you have "Overlap Left" TI and "Overlap Right" TI then any PIs that change the width setting for the wingers and fullbacks won't have any effect.
Btw, the test results kinda prove that because the difference between different width settings for the wingers and fullbacks when there are "Overlap Left" TI and "Overlap Right" TI are present is just less than 1 point, which is within the margin of error for 6K matches test.
So I suggest when you test PIs then make sure you don't use any TIs that might override the PIs.
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/3913-424-alhamdulillah-ii/
424 Alhamdulillah II
(w/o Overlaps)
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/3913-424-alhamdulillah-ii/
424 Alhamdulillah II
(W/O Focus Play Down The Flanks)
But in this test:
In the Round #1 the difference between tactics is "14" points.
In the Round #2 the difference between tactics is "9" points.
In the Round #3 the difference between tactics is "7" points.
The above result means that the stronger/weaker your team comparing with your opponents, the smaller role the tactic plays.
So testing tactics with a team that is much stronger or weaker than other teams in league isn't a good idea because such testing would be very ineffective.
Also, the result of this test shows that if you build a "Dream Team" with players like Mbappe, Messi, Neymar and similar best players then the quality of your tactic would become kinda irrelevant
I've done a similar test with this tactic - https://fm-arena.com/tactic/4210-poatan-451/
The same players were used to test both tactics.
Jamal Lowe was given Natural rating for CM position so it was possible to test both tactics with the same players.
There wasn't any player rotation. The same starting eleven were used to play all matches. The morale and conditions of the players were locked at 100%, which also was done for the AI teams.
The testing conditions were the same for both tests.
ROUND #1:
Default Attributes
In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 122
ROUND #2:
+2 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling
In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 142
ROUND #3:
+3 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling
In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 149
Once more, if you have any issues or complains then instead of calling out people and starting public brawls, you should contact the administration via private messages or email. Otherwise the only what you achieve is getting yourself into troubles.
This discussion is over.
Cheers.
I've added it to the queue.
Cheers.
@Wish, stop it or there'll be consequences.
Cheers.
I'm sure many of you, just like me, have wondered whether it's possible to win English Premier League managing one of the weakest team in the league or how long would it take to achieve that.
So I've done a test to find out it. I picked Bournemouth, one of the weakest team in the league that was predicted to finish 20th.
For the test I used this tactic - https://fm-arena.com/tactic/4094-424-alhamdulillah-ii-0-8/
After each round of testing I increased 7 important attributes from our attribute testing by 1 point - https://fm-arena.com/table/18-attribute-testing/
The 7 important attributes chosen for the increasing were: Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling.
ROUND #1:
Default Attributes
In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 122
ROUND #2:
+2 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling
In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 142
ROUND #3:
+3 Points to Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling
In the table below the results have been translated into 38 matches
Average CA = 149
As you can see winning EPL with the default Bournemouth team is a quite difficult task because the team gets only about 64 points on average per season when Man City and Liverpool get 85-90 points on average per season. I'd say winning the EPL with the default Bournemouth team is still possible but you need to be very lucky to do that, I mean your team must have the best season, far better than its average season and Man City and Liverpool must have the worst season, much worse than their average season.
When the Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling attributes of the players get 2 points increase then the team start getting about 85-87 points on average per season so wining EPL becomes a much easier task but still winning EPL isn't assured because if you have your worst season and Man City and Liverpool have their best season then highly likely they win the league.
Finally, when the Acceleration, Agility, Pace, Anticipating, Concentration, Work Rate and Dribbling attributes of the players get 3 points increase then the team starts getting 92-95 points on average per season, which further increases the chances of winning the EPL, it becomes almost assured.
I just wanted to demonstrate you how the game works, as you can see it isn't only about having the best tactic but also about having the best players. You can spend months on improving your tactic to improve the result by 1 point or you can increase 7 attributes of the players by 3 points and that would improve the result by about 30 points from 64 points to 94 points.
Also, look at the CA of the players in the Round 3, it's only about 150CA, which means it's still possible to get much better players with 160CA-180CA and further greatly improve the result but also, note that to have a solid chances of winning EPL it requires having at least 150CA players.
I hope this help.
Cheers.
It's a very slippery path and we won't go this way.
I hope you understand.
Cheers.
Yup, my mistake
Here's a correct link for 424 Alhamdulillah X ( Game Saves ) - https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ngQKyPNKGtj76wgiljtZMl8K2cAdSm7V/view?usp=sharing
424 Alhamdulillah II ( Game Saves ) - https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YgvsvYvhUyWJRsxHS0CNIeuIwSzg6n86/view?usp=sharing
424 Alhamdulillah X ( Game Saves ) - https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ngQKyPNKGtj76wgiljtZMl8K2cAdSm7V/view?usp=sharing
No, there're other reasons for that decision.
Yes, tactic are being added manually in the queue but don't worry we make sure that all uploaded tactics are reviewed and If some your tactics weren't picked for the testing then there was only one reason for that, they didn't meet the requirements - https://fm-arena.com/thread/2733-how-fm-arena-picks-tactics-for-the-testing/
Cheers.
It takes unnecessary efforts to click the spoiler to view the pictures.
Cheers.
It's a known fact that many people play the game or test tactics using "Go On Vacation/Holiday" approach but the full game version isn't supposed to be played like that, I'll explain what I mean.
From time to time players come to you with various concerns and issues, it looks like this:
They also get "Concerned" status in their "Player Status"
If you don't talk to players within few days after they became "Concerned" then they automatically turn "Unhappy", which means they are mad at you and might not talk to you for few weeks or months, all that time their Morale will be very poor:
Usually, many other players in the team start to support "Unhappy" players and also get a poor Morale.
You can look at the result of our test to find out how important the Morale is - https://fm-arena.com/table/20-condition-morale-testing/
IMPORTANT: If you think that your assistant manager handles the issues with players when you go on "Holiday/Vacation" then you're wrong because he doesn't do that ( the game doesn't have such mechanics ).
Also, it's important to understand that when you go on Holiday/Vacation then your assistant manager handles these important things:
- Assistant Manager does the team talks
- Assistant Manager picks players for the starting eleven
- Assistant Manager rotates the team
- Assistant Manager does substitutions
And if your assistant manager has poor attributes for handling these important things then the result will be much worse than they could be.
That's why it's very important to "Freeze" the morale and conditions with FMRTE when you test tactics.
Also, it's important to understand that playing/testing on "Holiday/Vacation" might produce much worse result than playing the game in normal way.
I hope this helps.
Cheers.
Using one spoiler per tactic & just renaming the thread (Example Delicious Tactic Collection) or something seems way more efficient.
I understand the frustration, it wasn't an easy decision but we have reasons for it.
I hope you understand.
I just want to let you know that from this moment only one tactic per thread is possible.
So don't be confused.
Also, don't worry the tactics that were uploaded under the old system will be tested as usual, of course, if they meet the requirements.
Cheers.
If you look at the result of this test - https://fm-arena.com/thread/2899-width/
then you'll see that there's almost no difference between the minimal value and the maximal value of the width setting.
Of course, for a different formation with different roles, duties, TIs the result might be different but I don't think there'll be much difference.
Anyway, if someone's gonna test different combinations of the Width setting for the wingers and fullback then obviously, it must be done without the "Overlap" TI because it might override the width settings of the wingers and fullbacks.
Yup, it could be the reason.
BUT still I think it's useful to know how it worked before ( it still might work the same right now ).
I've been noticing that an intensive testing of different width combinations for wingers and fullbacks happens here.
So I just want to share with you my thoughts and experience about it.
First of all, in order overlap runs happen the wingers must sit narrower than the fullbacks otherwise overlap runs won't happen.
And I'm almost sure that when you add "Overlap Left" TI and "Overlap Right" TI then this happens:
- the wingers get their width setting set at "Narrow"
- the fullbacks get their width setting set at "Wide"
- the wingers get their "Forward Runs" setting reduced
- the fullbacks get their "Forward Runs" setting increased
(some other things might happen under the hood)
As we know, TIs override PIs, which means if you have "Overlap Left" TI and "Overlap Right" TI then any PIs that change the width setting for the wingers and fullbacks won't have any effect.
Btw, the test results kinda prove that because the difference between different width settings for the wingers and fullbacks when there are "Overlap Left" TI and "Overlap Right" TI are present is just less than 1 point, which is within the margin of error for 6K matches test.
So I suggest when you test PIs then make sure you don't use any TIs that might override the PIs.
Cheers.