flob said: Interesting spreadsheet. I gave it a try and funny enough, when I put my own squad in and sort from Z to A on strikers (ST), the top 3 are all defenders lol I guess that happens? Expand
Yeah, but that's based purely on ingame attributes. Game engine kind of penalize you for selecting players out of their natural / trained positions and I didn't implement that in my spreadsheet obviously as it's not confirmed how big out of position penalty is.
flob said: There is something that I don't understand, so maybe you could clear this up. I am looking at your Classic ME numbers and there you have for the GK position on Throwing the number -0,00331. However, when I check the Genie scout file for this, it shows throwing as 51, which is higher then decisions, which is on 35.
How is throwing on 51, when the initial number is a negative number? Is this just a mistake or am I missing something here? Expand
-0,00331 is the coefficient for TRO, and TRO is not throwing. It is explained later in the opening post in the Disclaimer section:
Orion said: TRO is 'Rushing out (Tendency) - it's just how FM names that attribute when exporting. Expand
Trololo said: Can someone help me understand how to import the list of players into the excel file...? or is there a youtube tutorial for this ?
I downloaded the Excel file, and the 4 views, I go to FM, Squad tab of my team because I would like to analyze my squad first. I import the "Meta Own Team" view into FM, I select all the players and do CTRL P and text file.
This is the view I have in the IMPORT tab and I have nothing in CALCULATION, am I doing something wrong ? Expand
You have to print it as a web page (you should get html file), not as a plain text (txt file).
Yarema said: What do you mean? The effect of jumping reach should be much smaller than it was before.
Although honestly I think for now it would be best to just remove the double attributes for the time being. Too much confusion and desperately trying to make it work for very minimal effect. Expand
It certailny is smaller than before, what I meant is that ST formula still covers jumping reach twice. I just wanted to point out that square root of "X to the power of 2" is "X", so there's no need for making it more complex than it should be from mathematical point of view.
Orion said: Just to keep you guys up to date I've decided to make a small adjustment for the features that use two attributes - so the last one for MLR and the last one for Striker. I've decided to take square of a product from multiplication those features (SQR(Attribute1 * Attribute2) * Coefficient). This way you can keep it proportional to the coefficient. I don't know how it works with your files. I assume that for spreadsheet it's not an issue. What about GenieScout? Does it support other mathematical operations? If not I'd suggest just to get rid of those 2 features (since they are last important for given positions) and adjust others to sum up to 100% just like you did for the other positions. Expand
Updated the spreadsheet with your corrected rating evaluation for positions you mentioned. So now for striker it stacks up jumping reach, as it is taken into equation twice (most and least important coefficient - for the latter sqrt((jumping reach)^2) equals just jumping reach.
Yarema said: Yes but the model was working with adjusted numbers. Let me give an example. Average JR in the league is 12, a striker has 17. The way you explained stuff in the original post and later on basically says you take 17-12=5 so you do the calculations with 5. And isn't it possible that quadratic fits well for adjusted number (5) but not the actual number 17? Squaring numbers like 5 is a lot different that 17. Above 8 it basically dominates every other attribute basically double dipping (or triple since it's also the best attribute for a striker anyway).
Edit: Or to put it another way. Comparing JR contribution in above scenario if striker has 17 or 18 JR. Taking numbers at face up value you'd get roughly 1,27 vs 1,40. So a difference of 0,13 which would roughly be the effect of +6 pace. Using adjusted numbers of 5 and 6 makes the scores 0,49 and 0,55 respectively, a difference of 0,06 so half of the previous difference. Still equals +3 pace which feels a lot. Expand
Well, I guess this is derived from the idea of this experiment which is determining which attributes have the biggest impact on high match score. Hence, winning headers for ST has the biggest impact probably because striker has many oppurtinities to increase "key headers" stat during the match. Blind guess though.
Middleweight165 said: How would you filter the players? If I world scouting range, playing as Newcastle, I'll filter by age first so nobody over 30 and only players that are interested in joining me. This gives me 197,000 players which is obviously too much. I could do it by position but I still think its too many. Is there a way to filter further so im only putting the top players into your spreadsheet? Expand
Depends if you have attribute masking enabled or not. If not, I'd filter them by acceleration and pace >12, jumping reach >10, determination >10, work rate >10. Additionaly, if you have official ingame editor you can add professionalism >15, ambition >10, injury proneness <10 and PA >120. And search per position as well.
Middleweight165 said: I get an error message saying the 'All Players' views are not valid for the panel. Any solutions? The own team view works. I'm using own team view in squads and all players view in scouting -> shortlist Expand
It gives you error because this view is meant for scouting -> players section.
Orion said: Indeed. Thank you for noticing this. This should be with additional 0. Fixed in the main post. Second one also yes. I meant corners not crossing. Expand
That's what I thought, so I created pretty simple excel spreadsheet that make mass player comparison possible and easy.
Here's how it works: First, you need to import specified views. I created two sets of these: one for your team (for squad view) and one for scouting tab - both with CA & PA hidden - and another set with CA & PA visible for those who like to spoil the fun a little bit. Download and paste them into "views" folder in your Documents (C:\Users\your_name\Documents\Sports Interactive\Football Manager 2024\views is the default path).
When you load the view, you need to select every player, so click on one player and than ctrl+a to select everyone in the team or in the scouting range. Just bear in mind the more players you select, the more time it takes, so if you're about to select over 1000 players, give it a few seconds to work. Then, press cltr+p to "print" the selection into HTML file. Save it wherever you want, name it whatever you want. Then, you need the spreadsheet (MS Excel file). Open it and then in the Excel go to to File->Open and select the html file with your set of players. Copy it's whole contents (ctrl+a, then ctrl+c) and paste them into my spreadsheet in the blank sheet called "IMPORT" then switch the sheet to the one called "CALCULATION" and it should automatically calculate values for every player for each position using coefficients from this thread. Additionalli I added sections with CA, PA and difference between them (it will work only when you used views with PA and CA obviously).
Of course you can use whatever filters you want on the scouting section to narrow down the amount of players to whatever you really need.
At first glance it may sound complicated a bit but it's pretty easy to use. If you find any trouble using it, I'll try to help.
I believe there is a typo in DC coefficient: Orion said: Pac 0,158820 Expand It should be 0,015882, right?
Also you said: Orion said: The attributes that were excluded from the model are - Crossing, Free Kick Taking, Penalty Taking, Long Throws. It was decided due to those attributes affecting the outcome. Expand But I can see that crossing is still a valid coefficient in your lists on a number of positions. Did you mean corners by any chance?
Yeah, but that's based purely on ingame attributes. Game engine kind of penalize you for selecting players out of their natural / trained positions and I didn't implement that in my spreadsheet obviously as it's not confirmed how big out of position penalty is.
How is throwing on 51, when the initial number is a negative number? Is this just a mistake or am I missing something here?
-0,00331 is the coefficient for TRO, and TRO is not throwing. It is explained later in the opening post in the Disclaimer section:
Orion said: TRO is 'Rushing out (Tendency) - it's just how FM names that attribute when exporting.
or is there a youtube tutorial for this ?
I downloaded the Excel file, and the 4 views, I go to FM, Squad tab of my team because I would like to analyze my squad first.
I import the "Meta Own Team" view into FM, I select all the players and do CTRL P and text file.
This is the view I have in the IMPORT tab and I have nothing in CALCULATION, am I doing something wrong ?
You have to print it as a web page (you should get html file), not as a plain text (txt file).
Although honestly I think for now it would be best to just remove the double attributes for the time being. Too much confusion and desperately trying to make it work for very minimal effect.
It certailny is smaller than before, what I meant is that ST formula still covers jumping reach twice. I just wanted to point out that square root of "X to the power of 2" is "X", so there's no need for making it more complex than it should be from mathematical point of view.
I don't know how it works with your files. I assume that for spreadsheet it's not an issue.
What about GenieScout? Does it support other mathematical operations? If not I'd suggest just to get rid of those 2 features (since they are last important for given positions) and adjust others to sum up to 100% just like you did for the other positions.
Updated the spreadsheet with your corrected rating evaluation for positions you mentioned. So now for striker it stacks up jumping reach, as it is taken into equation twice (most and least important coefficient - for the latter sqrt((jumping reach)^2) equals just jumping reach.
Edit: Or to put it another way. Comparing JR contribution in above scenario if striker has 17 or 18 JR. Taking numbers at face up value you'd get roughly 1,27 vs 1,40. So a difference of 0,13 which would roughly be the effect of +6 pace.
Using adjusted numbers of 5 and 6 makes the scores 0,49 and 0,55 respectively, a difference of 0,06 so half of the previous difference. Still equals +3 pace which feels a lot.
Well, I guess this is derived from the idea of this experiment which is determining which attributes have the biggest impact on high match score. Hence, winning headers for ST has the biggest impact probably because striker has many oppurtinities to increase "key headers" stat during the match. Blind guess though.
Depends if you have attribute masking enabled or not. If not, I'd filter them by acceleration and pace >12, jumping reach >10, determination >10, work rate >10. Additionaly, if you have official ingame editor you can add professionalism >15, ambition >10, injury proneness <10 and PA >120. And search per position as well.
It gives you error because this view is meant for scouting -> players section.
Second one also yes. I meant corners not crossing.
That's what I thought, so I created pretty simple excel spreadsheet that make mass player comparison possible and easy.
Here's how it works:
First, you need to import specified views. I created two sets of these: one for your team (for squad view) and one for scouting tab - both with CA & PA hidden - and another set with CA & PA visible for those who like to spoil the fun a little bit. Download and paste them into "views" folder in your Documents (C:\Users\your_name\Documents\Sports Interactive\Football Manager 2024\views is the default path).
When you load the view, you need to select every player, so click on one player and than ctrl+a to select everyone in the team or in the scouting range. Just bear in mind the more players you select, the more time it takes, so if you're about to select over 1000 players, give it a few seconds to work.
Then, press cltr+p to "print" the selection into HTML file. Save it wherever you want, name it whatever you want.
Then, you need the spreadsheet (MS Excel file). Open it and then in the Excel go to to File->Open and select the html file with your set of players. Copy it's whole contents (ctrl+a, then ctrl+c) and paste them into my spreadsheet in the blank sheet called "IMPORT" then switch the sheet to the one called "CALCULATION" and it should automatically calculate values for every player for each position using coefficients from this thread. Additionalli I added sections with CA, PA and difference between them (it will work only when you used views with PA and CA obviously).
Of course you can use whatever filters you want on the scouting section to narrow down the amount of players to whatever you really need.
At first glance it may sound complicated a bit but it's pretty easy to use. If you find any trouble using it, I'll try to help.
Spreadsheet link: https://www.mediafire.com/file/huj2qrmavoqnd6x/meta.xlsx/file
Updated spreadsheet including square root formula for M LR and ST: https://www.mediafire.com/file/j2rh3e6vk2hjw7i/meta.xlsx/file
The spreadsheet is editable so do whatever you want with it, if you find any room for improvements, go for it.
Orion said: Pac 0,158820
It should be 0,015882, right?
Also you said:
Orion said: The attributes that were excluded from the model are - Crossing, Free Kick Taking, Penalty Taking, Long Throws. It was decided due to those attributes affecting the outcome.
But I can see that crossing is still a valid coefficient in your lists on a number of positions. Did you mean corners by any chance?