I can't see any pictures you post. But I'm sure it's nonsense anyway.
You never answer any questions. How exactly is genie scout bugged? It clearly isn't. Just your ratings are awful and you don't understand how to use it. So you make a claim that it's broken as it couldn't possibly be anything to do with you.
Nozdormu said: 1. If pressure has a weight 52, then it is super important, it is as important as acceleration and pace, isn't it? how much pressure is good? probably at least 15?
2. Are there any other attributes (just as pressure) which are important but you are not putting them into Genie Scout's calculations? I mean what else attributes (besides pressure) we need to manually filter them?
3. You use two ST with jump 17 to do the test, not DC, Did you ever use two DC with jumping 17 or 18 to test it?
4. Why give so much weight to balance and dribbling for DC? Expand
There's no way that pressure is eight behind speed. But then in the latest file it seems a lot of attributes are, which is simply not right. Speed is still so superior to every other attribute, or even 2-3 attributes combined, that you can't take these tests seriously.
Centre backs should have decent balance, it's another attribute every player should have a decent amount of, but they don't need dribbling. Dribbling is for wingers, 10's and full backs and fast strikers. Why you would want your centre back dribbling up the pitch I have no idea. Dribbling is strong in FM 24 for attacking. Speed is still more important but the truly elite wingers will have high dribbling, balance and agility.
If you have fast player's you won't get relegated if your centre backs have 13 jumping reach. Just more bonus testing. Recently Lockjaw ridiculed me for saying stamina was important in certain positions. Now he has the set at 52 also. He doesn't know what he's doing and changes his mind from tests using Knapp's best formations and blue set pieces. You can sometimes get Luton into Europe using that setup with no transfers. I mean come on.
BulldozerJokic said: Saying that wingers don't need jumping is absolutely ridiculous. The way top FM24 tactics work is that jumping on wingers is more important than jumping on strikers or even centrebacks. Just watch a couple of games to see it for yourself Expand
How many goals are these wingers scoring each season from headers?
Looking forward to your file for genie scout that has jumping reach 100 for wingers, 50 for centre backs and 25 for target striker. Sounds great!!
keithb said: How exactly is genie scout bugged? It clearly isn't. Just your ratings are awful and you don't understand how to use it. So you make a claim that it's broken as it couldn't possibly be anything to do with you. Expand I don't have access to Genie Scout so I've been calculating ratings manually using weights from different people. I multiply each attribute by its coefficient (assuming the attribute has a coefficient, sum the values and divide by a scaling value.
Doing this, I found the order of resultant players if different to the order Genie Scout presents, leading me to believe maybe it's factoring in footedness or height or positional familiarity, or maybe just not normalising personality values.
It's clearly doing something right because people have used it for years to build winning teams, I just noted that if you've taken care to tweak the weights then GS is going to do something you can't predict with them.
( edited 3 hours, 43 min ago by GeorgeFloydOverdosed )
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Nozdormu said: 1. If pressure has a weight 52, then it is super important, it is as important as acceleration and pace, isn't it? how much pressure is good? probably at least 15?
2. Are there any other attributes (just as pressure) which are important but you are not putting them into Genie Scout's calculations? I mean what else attributes (besides pressure) we need to manually filter them?
3. You use two ST with jump 17 to do the test, not DC, Did you ever use two DC with jumping 17 or 18 to test it?
4. Why give so much weight to balance and dribbling for DC? Expand Yes, pressure is important. I first saw this when I came across Orion's FM22 test on it, and I think HarvestGreen has recently posted data for this for FM24 too. It's not as critical as pace/acc, because it seems that 10 or a bit even lower can be sufficient. I would speculate that it's going to be like work rate where 6 is the point beyond which returns start to tail off. But as we can see from the chart, pressure 10 > 20 is a 10% boost which is still highly significant (equivalent to 1 > 10 consistency or determination).
The weights are simply their values x 4 right now. So pressure 52/4 = 13. I'm actually yet to test pressure less than 13 yet, I suspect it could drop a point or two. You haven't asked about how weightings should be derived from attribute levels that work, but it touches on the matter. I don't want to get into this anyway, but let's just say there's no one way of approaching it. At the moment, I'm going for a transparent, simple approach, and I will be giving this more thought later. To give you a straightforward example of what I mean, consider pace/acc. 14-15 is necessary to finish ~5th, but a team of 13 will get you relegated. So perhaps one would say let's make that 56 weighting 100 instead, just to ensure you get at least 14 pace/acc. And for pressure, it's 52 weighting, but you only *really* need say ~6-10, with little benefit for 14+, so maybe let's make that 45 instead of 52. In a way that produces better results, but the formula is more opaque and perhaps more whimsical, and yet there are also other downsides/trade-offs too when you start thinking about this deeply.
I think I have accidentally used 4xDC 17 with 2xST (out of 4) 17 and the result wasn't noticeably different (hence I didn't realize until a bit later).
I've answered the balance & dribbling for DC question, it's because the key attributes turn out to be equally essential for all outfield positions.
LightningFlik said: I don't have access to Genie Scout so I've been calculating ratings manually using weights from different people. I multiply each attribute by its coefficient (assuming the attribute has a coefficient, sum the values and divide by a scaling value.
Doing this, I found the order of resultant players if different to the order Genie Scout presents, leading me to believe maybe it's factoring in footedness or height or positional familiarity, or maybe just not normalising personality values.
It's clearly doing something right because people have used it for years to build winning teams, I just noted that if you've taken care to tweak the weights then GS is going to do something you can't predict with them. Expand
Thanks a for a decent and genuine reply.
I dont ever set consistency, important matches or any of the hidden with the scoring/weighting. Its not perfect and sometimes I wonder how a physical player isn't rated him. But its definitely accurate, not bugged with the scores and it will identify the elite and world class players if you set it up correctly.
I dont agree that GS is going to do something you cant predict. Again I've never had an issue, never missed a player.
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: Yes, pressure is important. I first saw this when I came across Orion's FM22 test on it, and I think HarvestGreen has recently posted data for this for FM24 too. It's not as critical as pace/acc, because it seems that 10 or a bit even lower can be sufficient. I would speculate that it's going to be like work rate where 6 is the point beyond which returns start to tail off. But as we can see from the chart, pressure 10 > 20 is a 10% boost which is still highly significant (equivalent to 1 > 10 consistency or determination).
The weights are simply their values x 4 right now. So pressure 52/4 = 13. I'm actually yet to test pressure less than 13 yet, I suspect it could drop a point or two. You haven't asked about how weightings should be derived from attribute levels that work, but it touches on the matter. I don't want to get into this anyway, but let's just say there's no one way of approaching it. At the moment, I'm going for a transparent, simple approach, and I will be giving this more thought later. To give you a straightforward example of what I mean, consider pace/acc. 14-15 is necessary to finish ~5th, but a team of 13 will get you relegated. So perhaps one would say let's make that 56 weighting 100 instead, just to ensure you get at least 14 pace/acc. And for pressure, it's 52 weighting, but you only *really* need say ~6-10, with little benefit for 14+, so maybe let's make that 45 instead of 52. In a way that produces better results, but the formula is more opaque and perhaps more whimsical, and yet there are also other downsides/trade-offs too when you start thinking about this deeply.
I think I have accidentally used 4xDC 17 with 2xST (out of 4) 17 and the result wasn't noticeably different (hence I didn't realize until a bit later).
I've answered the balance & dribbling for DC question, it's because the key attributes turn out to be equally essential for all outfield positions. Expand
harvestgreen22 said: The influence of pressure mainly focuses on 1-6. That is, similar to Work Rate, when the pressure is lower than 6, the players will face severe penalties (18.2%). However, when it is above 6, there are benefits, but the benefits are not as significant (8.9%). Expand
Who knew eh?!?! Once again we thank you for groundbreaking research(which was initially wrong. As always!!!)
keithb said: Who knew eh?!?! Once again we thank you for groundbreaking research(which was initially wrong. As always!!!) Expand What you don't realize is that I stated this before HarvestGreen said anything about pressure.
HarvestGreen's post was 29 March 2026.
15 December 2025:
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: I was surprised and intrigued by this finding by Orion in FM22 that pressure 1 supposedly results in 47% less performance than pressure 10.
That's a 32% drop in performance. It is important to note though that Orion found the difference between 10 pressure and 20 pressure to only be 10%, but even that is significant. Expand 19 December 2025:
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: I would guess that ~8 is not too bad either, based on how work rate matters a great deal up to just 6 then it tails off. Expand Both in this very thread.
Not that I discovered the effect of pressure of course, I've always credited Orion for that from the get go. My point is that I have long hypothesized that pressure functions as work rate does, and also I think it's fair to say that Orion's findings had been largely ignored and forgotten, so I think I will give myself a pat on the back for breathing fresh life into this piece of knowledge.
Or is keithb going to claim that, as with everything else, everybody already knew pressure was the most important personality attribute?
I can't see any pictures you post. But I'm sure it's nonsense anyway.
You never answer any questions. How exactly is genie scout bugged? It clearly isn't. Just your ratings are awful and you don't understand how to use it. So you make a claim that it's broken as it couldn't possibly be anything to do with you.
Nozdormu said: 1. If pressure has a weight 52, then it is super important, it is as important as acceleration and pace, isn't it? how much pressure is good? probably at least 15?
2. Are there any other attributes (just as pressure) which are important but you are not putting them into Genie Scout's calculations? I mean what else attributes (besides pressure) we need to manually filter them?
3. You use two ST with jump 17 to do the test, not DC, Did you ever use two DC with jumping 17 or 18 to test it?
4. Why give so much weight to balance and dribbling for DC?
There's no way that pressure is eight behind speed. But then in the latest file it seems a lot of attributes are, which is simply not right. Speed is still so superior to every other attribute, or even 2-3 attributes combined, that you can't take these tests seriously.
Centre backs should have decent balance, it's another attribute every player should have a decent amount of, but they don't need dribbling. Dribbling is for wingers, 10's and full backs and fast strikers. Why you would want your centre back dribbling up the pitch I have no idea. Dribbling is strong in FM 24 for attacking. Speed is still more important but the truly elite wingers will have high dribbling, balance and agility.
If you have fast player's you won't get relegated if your centre backs have 13 jumping reach. Just more bonus testing. Recently Lockjaw ridiculed me for saying stamina was important in certain positions. Now he has the set at 52 also. He doesn't know what he's doing and changes his mind from tests using Knapp's best formations and blue set pieces. You can sometimes get Luton into Europe using that setup with no transfers. I mean come on.
BulldozerJokic said: Saying that wingers don't need jumping is absolutely ridiculous. The way top FM24 tactics work is that jumping on wingers is more important than jumping on strikers or even centrebacks. Just watch a couple of games to see it for yourself
How many goals are these wingers scoring each season from headers?
Looking forward to your file for genie scout that has jumping reach 100 for wingers, 50 for centre backs and 25 for target striker. Sounds great!!
keithb said: How exactly is genie scout bugged? It clearly isn't. Just your ratings are awful and you don't understand how to use it. So you make a claim that it's broken as it couldn't possibly be anything to do with you.
I don't have access to Genie Scout so I've been calculating ratings manually using weights from different people. I multiply each attribute by its coefficient (assuming the attribute has a coefficient, sum the values and divide by a scaling value.
Doing this, I found the order of resultant players if different to the order Genie Scout presents, leading me to believe maybe it's factoring in footedness or height or positional familiarity, or maybe just not normalising personality values.
It's clearly doing something right because people have used it for years to build winning teams, I just noted that if you've taken care to tweak the weights then GS is going to do something you can't predict with them.
Nozdormu said: 1. If pressure has a weight 52, then it is super important, it is as important as acceleration and pace, isn't it? how much pressure is good? probably at least 15?
2. Are there any other attributes (just as pressure) which are important but you are not putting them into Genie Scout's calculations? I mean what else attributes (besides pressure) we need to manually filter them?
3. You use two ST with jump 17 to do the test, not DC, Did you ever use two DC with jumping 17 or 18 to test it?
4. Why give so much weight to balance and dribbling for DC?
Yes, pressure is important. I first saw this when I came across Orion's FM22 test on it, and I think HarvestGreen has recently posted data for this for FM24 too. It's not as critical as pace/acc, because it seems that 10 or a bit even lower can be sufficient. I would speculate that it's going to be like work rate where 6 is the point beyond which returns start to tail off. But as we can see from the chart, pressure 10 > 20 is a 10% boost which is still highly significant (equivalent to 1 > 10 consistency or determination).
The weights are simply their values x 4 right now. So pressure 52/4 = 13. I'm actually yet to test pressure less than 13 yet, I suspect it could drop a point or two. You haven't asked about how weightings should be derived from attribute levels that work, but it touches on the matter. I don't want to get into this anyway, but let's just say there's no one way of approaching it. At the moment, I'm going for a transparent, simple approach, and I will be giving this more thought later. To give you a straightforward example of what I mean, consider pace/acc. 14-15 is necessary to finish ~5th, but a team of 13 will get you relegated. So perhaps one would say let's make that 56 weighting 100 instead, just to ensure you get at least 14 pace/acc. And for pressure, it's 52 weighting, but you only *really* need say ~6-10, with little benefit for 14+, so maybe let's make that 45 instead of 52. In a way that produces better results, but the formula is more opaque and perhaps more whimsical, and yet there are also other downsides/trade-offs too when you start thinking about this deeply.
I think I have accidentally used 4xDC 17 with 2xST (out of 4) 17 and the result wasn't noticeably different (hence I didn't realize until a bit later).
I've answered the balance & dribbling for DC question, it's because the key attributes turn out to be equally essential for all outfield positions.
LightningFlik said: I don't have access to Genie Scout so I've been calculating ratings manually using weights from different people. I multiply each attribute by its coefficient (assuming the attribute has a coefficient, sum the values and divide by a scaling value.
Doing this, I found the order of resultant players if different to the order Genie Scout presents, leading me to believe maybe it's factoring in footedness or height or positional familiarity, or maybe just not normalising personality values.
It's clearly doing something right because people have used it for years to build winning teams, I just noted that if you've taken care to tweak the weights then GS is going to do something you can't predict with them.
Thanks a for a decent and genuine reply.
I dont ever set consistency, important matches or any of the hidden with the scoring/weighting. Its not perfect and sometimes I wonder how a physical player isn't rated him. But its definitely accurate, not bugged with the scores and it will identify the elite and world class players if you set it up correctly.
I dont agree that GS is going to do something you cant predict. Again I've never had an issue, never missed a player.
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: Yes, pressure is important. I first saw this when I came across Orion's FM22 test on it, and I think HarvestGreen has recently posted data for this for FM24 too. It's not as critical as pace/acc, because it seems that 10 or a bit even lower can be sufficient. I would speculate that it's going to be like work rate where 6 is the point beyond which returns start to tail off. But as we can see from the chart, pressure 10 > 20 is a 10% boost which is still highly significant (equivalent to 1 > 10 consistency or determination).
The weights are simply their values x 4 right now. So pressure 52/4 = 13. I'm actually yet to test pressure less than 13 yet, I suspect it could drop a point or two. You haven't asked about how weightings should be derived from attribute levels that work, but it touches on the matter. I don't want to get into this anyway, but let's just say there's no one way of approaching it. At the moment, I'm going for a transparent, simple approach, and I will be giving this more thought later. To give you a straightforward example of what I mean, consider pace/acc. 14-15 is necessary to finish ~5th, but a team of 13 will get you relegated. So perhaps one would say let's make that 56 weighting 100 instead, just to ensure you get at least 14 pace/acc. And for pressure, it's 52 weighting, but you only *really* need say ~6-10, with little benefit for 14+, so maybe let's make that 45 instead of 52. In a way that produces better results, but the formula is more opaque and perhaps more whimsical, and yet there are also other downsides/trade-offs too when you start thinking about this deeply.
I think I have accidentally used 4xDC 17 with 2xST (out of 4) 17 and the result wasn't noticeably different (hence I didn't realize until a bit later).
I've answered the balance & dribbling for DC question, it's because the key attributes turn out to be equally essential for all outfield positions.
harvestgreen22 said: The influence of pressure mainly focuses on 1-6. That is, similar to Work Rate, when the pressure is lower than 6, the players will face severe penalties (18.2%).
However, when it is above 6, there are benefits, but the benefits are not as significant (8.9%).
Who knew eh?!?! Once again we thank you for groundbreaking research(which was initially wrong. As always!!!)
keithb said: Who knew eh?!?! Once again we thank you for groundbreaking research(which was initially wrong. As always!!!)
What you don't realize is that I stated this before HarvestGreen said anything about pressure.
HarvestGreen's post was 29 March 2026.
15 December 2025:
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: I was surprised and intrigued by this finding by Orion in FM22 that pressure 1 supposedly results in 47% less performance than pressure 10.
So I've tested it, and it really is important:
115 CA templates pressure 1 - 102, +127 | 105, +119
That's a 32% drop in performance. It is important to note though that Orion found the difference between 10 pressure and 20 pressure to only be 10%, but even that is significant.
19 December 2025:
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: I would guess that ~8 is not too bad either, based on how work rate matters a great deal up to just 6 then it tails off.
Both in this very thread.
Not that I discovered the effect of pressure of course, I've always credited Orion for that from the get go. My point is that I have long hypothesized that pressure functions as work rate does, and also I think it's fair to say that Orion's findings had been largely ignored and forgotten, so I think I will give myself a pat on the back for breathing fresh life into this piece of knowledge.
Or is keithb going to claim that, as with everything else, everybody already knew pressure was the most important personality attribute?