Mark said: I have added a new version of this tactic which is over the top attacking. Dragon Breath 3.1. Moved the F9 across to AF and brought the CM Attack up to F9. This has given a ridiculous amount of scoring. Even got Norwich to 4th at the end of the season in EPL.
Expand
This seems very promising! Love the F9 use. Did you try with IW instead of wingers?
Added a version with a minor tweak: Dribble more on central defenders. I am curious as to if this makes any difference in conceding/scoring since everyone seems to use it. If the team could test this out I would appreciate very much.
FB-S is a little too defensive and cautious going forward. I like FB-A because they tend to act like wingers on the attack, but as opposed to wing-backs, they drop deeper when defending.
Update on the Bilbao save, this might be one of the best tactics I've made, at least defensively. 16 conceded in 26 matches. No transfers (duh), first season.
PLEASE DOWNLOAD "Positive Tiki-Taka" AS THAT IS THE BEST PERFORMING CURRENTLY!
I created this playing my Bilbao save, because almost all of Bilbao's wonderkids and prospects have ridiculously low stamina and I've found myself having to sub them at half time using the usual tactics.
So I took my Dazzling 4-3-3 tactic and tweaked it hard to adapt to a positive mentality that would not kill my players. This tactic is great for long term saves where you don't have the very best in terms of stamina or you don't have great squad depth options. It is also great for possession football and is not quick-counter as are most good tactics.
Here are some results, with Bilbao and in my tweaked Testing League. I don't know if this was a lucky run or not. This is all done with CA160 players with same attributes frozen to max everything in the test league. Both cases least goals conceded!
Since this is getting so much attention, I have decided to do a little FAQ from which people will hopefully be able to better optimize the tactic.
How does/will the tactic work?
The tactic is roughly modelled after '08 Barca with Messi playing as F9. Quick, shorter passing encouraged, DLP as a Pivot to pass balls to everyone, CM(A) and the attacking trio to overload the opponent. The lack of an AM calls for a more deep central attacker (DLF/F9), as there would be no link-up with a classic forward.
Defensively, pressing is high, relies heavily on recovering the ball early using the high number of attacking players.
Will this work in lower leagues?
I'd say this holds its own in terms of stamina still, and in terms of positions, it is the most basic tactic you can get. It uses some of the most common positions regens spawn in, and you should be able to play pretty much whatever you've got in those positions.
Can I change the F9 to another position?
It's complicated. Yes, if you are planning to change it to a DLF. I don't think that would make a huge difference. No if you are planning to change it to a poacher. Keep in mind that the F9 acts more like an AM in this tactic, you should have your "Messi" in this position, the jack of all trades. Passing, Vision, Dribbling, Mentals, not just Pace. Fast classic attackers should go on IF. Also, you can retrain pretty much any talented AM or more creative ST to be a F9.
Made an annoying 5 at the back tactic. Lot of crossing going on. Results are in a tweaked league with conditions similar to the testing league. Think it could do pretty well. Also added a WCB version for people who don't wanna use 3 BPD-s. I am also curious which 3 CB combinations works better.
I found myself with 1 too many CB wonderkids one season and decided to try this out. Seemed to work so I tested it and seems pretty solid.
I have explained in previous tactics which attributes I prioritise, check them out here!
I'm rather new to the tactic posting thing, I always created my own tactics, but I like to think I had a good idea or 2 and that at least some of my tactics are good and multiple people enjoyed them.
Personally, I have absolutely nothing against people tweaking my stuff and posting, as long as they mention me at least. If you heavily modify a tactic, no need for that, but I think if you use the exact same formation/roles with different instructions, you should give credit. Just my 2 cents.
EDIT: Tactics are not intellectual property, everyone should be free to use them and post them, credit would be nice but can't be enforced, it is ultimately always going to be a choice of admitting to "taking inspiration" or not, depends on the poster and if they wanna credit or not, and that's how it should stay to improve the quality of the tactics.
Glad to see someone else using F9's! They're pretty damn good this year and really fun to watch. What are the specific settings on the testing league? Would you mind sharing it @ZaZ ?
Zealot said: @cptdoggo, here are just few tactics from FM20. As I said it's just impossible to come with something unique at this point in FM because everything has been tried already.
Again, apologies if you actually didn't base it on that one, but it's literally the same exact roles in each position, the ones you show here all have at least a role switch. Ours are the same tactic in terms of roles, just with the standard "meta" instructions.
EDIT: Again, congrats for making it work, I couldn't get it to this level, I was just very surprised to see the exact same formation/roles as mine top the charts.
Great tactic! Although, I don't know if you did or didn't, but could this be in any way inspired by my Pep formation here? It just seems to me like this tactic is ZaZ's general instructions pasted over this tactic. I'm sorry if it's not but it's exactly the same roles and almost exactly similar personal instructions, just mark tighter added on all positions.
EDIT: This is not to knock this tactic, it's better than my original one, ofc, but some credit would be nice if you're just gonna tweak it.
Added a few tweaks to my F9 formation as I have been using this tweaked tactic in my saves. Seems to work a little better than the original so I gave it a quick test and it worked great!
sorte said: Okay - but the two CM's is both central midfielders on attack with the same instructions so there isn't anythink to change - i'm using the v3 tactic?
And should i still use a F9 even though i have a bigger supporting striker with the player trait to play with back to the goal? Expand
Oh right, sorry, yeah nothing should change if you switch them. I would just leave him in F9 duty if his stats fit the role
Filer974 said: After Watford, I am at PSV, victory in the cup and in the league. 3 attackers slamming goal after goal ... Great. I am champion even if Ajax ends the season undefeated Expand
Yeah, I love in this tactic that all 3 in the front are scoring and assisting a lot. Really helps develop your attackers better.
sorte said: You were saying in the original post that the DLF was a guy who should play with his back to the goal and hold up play, is it the same with the F9 in the 3 version of the tactic?
And should i switch the roles of the strikers if my more creating player is left footed and the more goal getter is right footed? Expand
The F9 tends to do pretty much the same things, he just gets between lines more often and plays more like an AM. It's a more viable role if your supporting striker is small-ish and can't catch long balls. I don't find feet to matter all that much, but you should switch the CM's as well if you switch strikers.
Seeing as this is still my most defensively sound tactic, I decided to give it one last mix so people can enjoy a defensive tactic as well that can produce points.
Changelog: -Changed DLF to False 9 as it seems to perform better as a deeper striker. -Changed both mids to CM (Attack) as it provides the most versatility. -Changed some personal instructions with ones I have found to work the best during my other tests.
Cruyff said: good results, but very low ball possession, so, except of the shape, nothing much to do with Cruijff style of play. With lower tempo, possession is higher, but results are not that good anymore Expand
Try Slightly Shorter Passing instruction + Slightly Higher Tempo, noticed that gives you most possession. It's literally impossible to reach 50%+ possession this year without sacrificing good performances.
EDIT: Could you also post your results if you want? Thanks
Positive mentality is pretty big difference
This seems very promising! Love the F9 use. Did you try with IW instead of wingers?
FB-S is a little too defensive and cautious going forward. I like FB-A because they tend to act like wingers on the attack, but as opposed to wing-backs, they drop deeper when defending.
Yeah, I've been using the solo f9 position very successfully this year.
I created this playing my Bilbao save, because almost all of Bilbao's wonderkids and prospects have ridiculously low stamina and I've found myself having to sub them at half time using the usual tactics.
So I took my Dazzling 4-3-3 tactic and tweaked it hard to adapt to a positive mentality that would not kill my players. This tactic is great for long term saves where you don't have the very best in terms of stamina or you don't have great squad depth options. It is also great for possession football and is not quick-counter as are most good tactics.
Here are some results, with Bilbao and in my tweaked Testing League. I don't know if this was a lucky run or not. This is all done with CA160 players with same attributes frozen to max everything in the test league. Both cases least goals conceded!
LATER EDIT:
22.2 Results Showcase
Since this is getting so much attention, I have decided to do a little FAQ from which people will hopefully be able to better optimize the tactic.
How does/will the tactic work?
The tactic is roughly modelled after '08 Barca with Messi playing as F9. Quick, shorter passing encouraged, DLP as a Pivot to pass balls to everyone, CM(A) and the attacking trio to overload the opponent. The lack of an AM calls for a more deep central attacker (DLF/F9), as there would be no link-up with a classic forward.
Defensively, pressing is high, relies heavily on recovering the ball early using the high number of attacking players.
Will this work in lower leagues?
I'd say this holds its own in terms of stamina still, and in terms of positions, it is the most basic tactic you can get. It uses some of the most common positions regens spawn in, and you should be able to play pretty much whatever you've got in those positions.
Can I change the F9 to another position?
It's complicated. Yes, if you are planning to change it to a DLF. I don't think that would make a huge difference. No if you are planning to change it to a poacher. Keep in mind that the F9 acts more like an AM in this tactic, you should have your "Messi" in this position, the jack of all trades. Passing, Vision, Dribbling, Mentals, not just Pace. Fast classic attackers should go on IF. Also, you can retrain pretty much any talented AM or more creative ST to be a F9.
I found myself with 1 too many CB wonderkids one season and decided to try this out. Seemed to work so I tested it and seems pretty solid.
I have explained in previous tactics which attributes I prioritise, check them out here!
Personally, I have absolutely nothing against people tweaking my stuff and posting, as long as they mention me at least. If you heavily modify a tactic, no need for that, but I think if you use the exact same formation/roles with different instructions, you should give credit. Just my 2 cents.
EDIT: Tactics are not intellectual property, everyone should be free to use them and post them, credit would be nice but can't be enforced, it is ultimately always going to be a choice of admitting to "taking inspiration" or not, depends on the poster and if they wanna credit or not, and that's how it should stay to improve the quality of the tactics.
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/560-barcelona-tiki-taka-by-birol-ztrk-fm-2020/
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/362-break/
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/378-ww2-4-1-2-2-1-2020-the-comeback/
Again, apologies if you actually didn't base it on that one, but it's literally the same exact roles in each position, the ones you show here all have at least a role switch. Ours are the same tactic in terms of roles, just with the standard "meta" instructions.
EDIT: Again, congrats for making it work, I couldn't get it to this level, I was just very surprised to see the exact same formation/roles as mine top the charts.
EDIT: This is not to knock this tactic, it's better than my original one, ofc, but some credit would be nice if you're just gonna tweak it.
And should i still use a F9 even though i have a bigger supporting striker with the player trait to play with back to the goal?
Oh right, sorry, yeah nothing should change if you switch them. I would just leave him in F9 duty if his stats fit the role
Yeah, I love in this tactic that all 3 in the front are scoring and assisting a lot. Really helps develop your attackers better.
And should i switch the roles of the strikers if my more creating player is left footed and the more goal getter is right footed?
The F9 tends to do pretty much the same things, he just gets between lines more often and plays more like an AM. It's a more viable role if your supporting striker is small-ish and can't catch long balls. I don't find feet to matter all that much, but you should switch the CM's as well if you switch strikers.
Changelog:
-Changed DLF to False 9 as it seems to perform better as a deeper striker.
-Changed both mids to CM (Attack) as it provides the most versatility.
-Changed some personal instructions with ones I have found to work the best during my other tests.
Results with this tactic:
Results with my other 5.5* tactic (Blitz4-4-2)
Things seem promising.
Try Slightly Shorter Passing instruction + Slightly Higher Tempo, noticed that gives you most possession. It's literally impossible to reach 50%+ possession this year without sacrificing good performances.
EDIT: Could you also post your results if you want? Thanks