On the new testing league it got 34 points / -24 G.D., which about 20 point less than the top rated tactics.
And now let's boost the attributes of the players in the Human Controlled teams by increasing 11 of 29 the most important attributes( according to our attribute testing ) by "2" points:
As you can see the points have increased from 34 points to 70 points and the G.D. from -23 to +25 and it turned the Human Controlled team into into dominant winners from complete losers.
All that indicates that if in real game you use this tactic with such teams as Man City, PSG, Barcelona, Real Madrid and so on then you'll be winning matches almost as good as you would done that if you used any top rated(51+ points) tactic from our tactic testing.
People often overestimate the importance of the tactic and underestimate the importance of the players. They think that if they have a striker with 15 Acceleration and Pace then it's already good enough and they shouldn't look for a better striker with 16 or 17 or higher Acceleration and Pace because they think that won't make much difference but that's wrong thinking because it'll make a huge difference.
But the trick is that not all attribute makes such a big difference, for example, there'll be almost no difference between 10 and 20 Team Work for any position/role but if you look at the game this fact isn't obvious and the game doesn't explain it, but on the contrary - it confuses people with highlighted attributes for different roles and duties, creating impression that for example, Team Work attribute might be one the most important attributers for some position/roles/duties and Acceleration and Pace attributes aren't important at all and they can be overlooked, which is completely untrue.
I don't say that the tactic don't matter at all because if you look at our tactic testing then you'll see that some tactics got 55 points and some tactics got only 35 points, so under certain conditions one tactic can give you 20 points more than other tactic and it's a significant difference.
But it's important to understand that if you use one the top rated tactic(51+) and you aren't stratified with your result and you want to bring on the next level then tweaking your or changing it won't make any significant difference, at the best you improve your result +2-3 points but if you looking like for +20 or +30 points improvement then it can't be done without improving the most important attributed of your player, probably, by buying better players.
Also, there's another huge trap for FM players in the game. When you play with an underdog or midtable team the game RNG is very huge, your results can vary up to 20-30 points with the same tactic if we take 38 matches and that can be very misleading by creating impression that some tactics or tweaks work much better than other and it's when our tactic testing can help. Expand
This is amazing.. with your initial tests i thought that you were right and tactics barely matter, but now with this new test it all makes sense..
I guess that the community gives higher importance to tactics because maybe in Championship Manager times Diablo tactic sorted everything
The tactics you choose are already good tactics accordingly to the table. Can you pick up the literally the worst tactic in the table and do the same test (increasing by +1 or +2 the most important attributes?
By all means, im not saying you're wrong. Just curious to know if the points vary so much with such a "bad" tactic (no offense here to the creator of whatever tactic there is)
Temperamental Temperament 1-4, Professionalism 1-10 This personality trumps pretty much every single other one, so if they are not temperamental, they don't have these attributes.
Im also interesting to see what our gurus from this forum can say about this topic.. I would also ask you guys what are the best personalities to be mentors? I know model citizen is the best one, but what about the others?
When i say good result im comparing with last FMs.. I think you agree with me that in past versions with a single tactic you could win everything, right?
Of course that good players also helps a lot, but im just saying that there is a balance between good players and good tactic.. Maybe on this version is something like 70% weight on good players and 30% tactic, however in past versions i would say its the opposite.
Hey.. im using this tactic (v3) but im getting a lot of yellow/red cards:
Is there anyway i can tweak this to avoid getting so many cards? during game im already changing the tackling to "ease off tackles" when someone gets booked, but still having a lot of cards as you can see
ZaZ said: The highest the attributes of a player at early age, the highest the chance to have high potential. Remember that players grow extremely fast until 18, then they grow just fast until 23, then slow until 27, and after that their growth usually stop. Expand
Got it.. but should i give higher importance to certain attributes?
Pikabo said: Tactical Real CA. Basically it should calculate player's usefulness on the position based on his attributes using the ykyky balanced table for attribute weighing. Post#113 on page 4 should give you any idea of how to do it and then Mark made it more graphical in post #285 on page 10. Expand
got it, thanks.. but in Mark's post (page 4, #113) he's subtracting the formula by 121. any ideia why the 121 specifically?
Mark said: I decided to try and find a way to get best value for money for buying players. I have used the ykykyky ratings file which finds the best players by position, I know just using acceleration and pace will result in pretty good players especially in lower divisions. What I decided to focus on was attributes with low CA cost, using the attribute cost table, but big positional impact ie high weighting in the ykykyky rating file. I only looked at rating weights of 50 or higher.
I then ranked the attributes after calculating the attribute weight divided by CA cost.
I think the attribute scores that are above 15 are the ones to use. I have been using the Division average and adding a point or 2 and searching for players. I seem to be getting pretty good players using this approach. My most recent save is tier 8 in the English system. I struggled early and was 6 wins 2 draws and 2 losses after the first 10 games. I restarted the save and bought 10 players using this approach, to cover all outfield positions using ZaZ Blue 4.0. Won the first 10 games.
If you give it a try, please let me know how you go. Expand
Hey @Mark sorry but im feeling quite stupid today What you're saying is that the best attribute per position (CA cost wise) would be Vision for DCs, Off the ball for DRL and so on? Meaning, if i only train these attributes i will get my players to the best performance possible instead of just train them for quickness. Am I wrong?
Hi guys, i know that CM Mezzala is not in this tactic, but i use it on my own tactic - would you recommend the same attributes as a DM in this table? if not, what would you consider to be the top 5 attributes?
On the new testing league it got 34 points / -24 G.D., which about 20 point less than the top rated tactics.
And now let's boost the attributes of the players in the Human Controlled teams by increasing 11 of 29 the most important attributes( according to our attribute testing ) by "2" points:
The most important attributes from our test - ( https://fm-arena.com/table/18-attribute-testing/ )
- Acceleration
- Agility
- Balance
- Pace
- Strength
- Stamina
- Anticipation
- Concentration
- Work Rate
- Finishing
- Dribbling
Default Attributes
Increased Attributes
As you can see the points have increased from 34 points to 70 points and the G.D. from -23 to +25 and it turned the Human Controlled team into into dominant winners from complete losers.
All that indicates that if in real game you use this tactic with such teams as Man City, PSG, Barcelona, Real Madrid and so on then you'll be winning matches almost as good as you would done that if you used any top rated(51+ points) tactic from our tactic testing.
People often overestimate the importance of the tactic and underestimate the importance of the players. They think that if they have a striker with 15 Acceleration and Pace then it's already good enough and they shouldn't look for a better striker with 16 or 17 or higher Acceleration and Pace because they think that won't make much difference but that's wrong thinking because it'll make a huge difference.
But the trick is that not all attribute makes such a big difference, for example, there'll be almost no difference between 10 and 20 Team Work for any position/role but if you look at the game this fact isn't obvious and the game doesn't explain it, but on the contrary - it confuses people with highlighted attributes for different roles and duties, creating impression that for example, Team Work attribute might be one the most important attributers for some position/roles/duties and Acceleration and Pace attributes aren't important at all and they can be overlooked, which is completely untrue.
I don't say that the tactic don't matter at all because if you look at our tactic testing then you'll see that some tactics got 55 points and some tactics got only 35 points, so under certain conditions one tactic can give you 20 points more than other tactic and it's a significant difference.
But it's important to understand that if you use one the top rated tactic(51+) and you aren't stratified with your result and you want to bring on the next level then tweaking your or changing it won't make any significant difference, at the best you improve your result +2-3 points but if you looking like for +20 or +30 points improvement then it can't be done without improving the most important attributed of your player, probably, by buying better players.
Also, there's another huge trap for FM players in the game. When you play with an underdog or midtable team the game RNG is very huge, your results can vary up to 20-30 points with the same tactic if we take 38 matches and that can be very misleading by creating impression that some tactics or tweaks work much better than other and it's when our tactic testing can help.
This is amazing.. with your initial tests i thought that you were right and tactics barely matter, but now with this new test it all makes sense..
I guess that the community gives higher importance to tactics because maybe in Championship Manager times Diablo tactic sorted everything
Can you pick up the literally the worst tactic in the table and do the same test (increasing by +1 or +2 the most important attributes?
By all means, im not saying you're wrong. Just curious to know if the points vary so much with such a "bad" tactic (no offense here to the creator of whatever tactic there is)
Its the new testing mode
Player Personalities:
Spoiler Ambitious
Ambition 16-19, Loyalty 7-9
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leadership <19
Balanced
Balanced is pretty much anything that doesn't fall under another label. Also covers all negative personalities for real life players.
Born Leader
Leadership 20, Determination 20
This trumps the perfectionist trait, but not model citizen or temperamental.
Casual
Determination 1-9, Professionalism 2-4
Leadership<19, Temperament >4
Charismatic Leader
Leadership 19-20, Temperament18-20, Sportsmanship 18-20
Determined
Determination 18-20,
Ambition <12, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Devoted
Ambition 6-7, Loyalty 20. *Must also be at a favourite club.
Determination 6-17, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Driven
Determination 18-20, Ambition 12-20
Easily Discouraged
Determination 1, Ambition 1-9
Fairly Ambitious
Ambition 15-20, Loyalty 10-20
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Fairly Determined
Determination 15-17
Professionalism <15, Leader <19
Fairly Loyal
Loyalty 15-20, Ambition 8-14
Determination 6-15, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Fairly Professional
Professionalism 15-17, Temperament 11-20
or Professionalism 18-20, Temperamemt 1-10
Fairly Sporting
Sportsmanship 15-20, Determination 10-14, Ambition 1-14
Professionalism <15
Fickle
Loyalty 4-6, Ambition 16-20
Determination <17, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Honest
Sportsmanship 20, Determination 1-9
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Iron Willed
Pressure 20, Determination 15-17
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Jovial
Pressure 15-20, Determination 1-17
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Leader
Leadership 19-20
Light Hearted
Pressure 15-20, Sportsmanship 15-20
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Low Determination
Determination 1-5
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Low Self Belief
Professionalism 2-3, Determination 1-9
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Loyal
Loyalty 18-19, Ambition 6-7
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Mercenary
Loyalty 1-3, Ambition 16-20
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Model Citizen
Determination 14-20, Professionalism 15-20, Ambition 12-20, Loyalty 15-20, Pressure 14-20, Sportsmanship 15-20, Temperament 15-20
Model Professional
Professionalism 20, Temperament 10-20
Perfectionist
Determination 14-20, Professionalism 14-20, Ambition 14-20
Professional
Professionalism 18-19, Temperament 10-20
Leader <19
Realist
Sportsmanship 2-5, Determination 11-17
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Resiliant
Pressure 17-19, Determination 15-17
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Resolute
Determination 15-17, Proffessionalism 15-17
Leader <19
Slack
Professionalism 1, Determination 1-9
Temperament >4, Leader <19
Spineless
Pressure 1, Determination 1-9
Leader <19
Spirited
Pressure 15-20, Professionalism 11-17
Determination <18, Leader <19
Sporting
Sportsmanship 18-19, Determination 1-9
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Temperamental
Temperament 1-4, Professionalism 1-10
This personality trumps pretty much every single other one, so if they are not temperamental, they don't have these attributes.
Unambitious
Ambition 1-5, Loyalty 11-20
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Unsporting
Sportsmanship 1, Determination 11-17
Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Very Ambitious
Ambition 20, Loyalty 7-9
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
Very Loyal
Loyalty 20, Ambition 6-7
Determination <18, Professionalism <18, Leader <19
You've just mentioned all the possible personalities, whereas i've asked for the best ones....
Of course that good players also helps a lot, but im just saying that there is a balance between good players and good tactic.. Maybe on this version is something like 70% weight on good players and 30% tactic, however in past versions i would say its the opposite.
Dont you agree?
I'm sure you'll win the league easily.
Wouldn't it be a good result? So what's the problem?
I think that a good result would be win everything with a team like PSG...
Also a good result would be picking up Angers or something like that and be league champion
Is there anyway i can tweak this to avoid getting so many cards? during game im already changing the tackling to "ease off tackles" when someone gets booked, but still having a lot of cards as you can see
Got it.. but should i give higher importance to certain attributes?
I've started with a low league team, therefore my scouts ability are, for lack of a better word, questionable.
Therefore i want to know, besides reading personalities and media description, how can i spot that an 15/16 years old regen has a good potential?
Usually i only look to the Determination and Acc/Pace attributes. Am i doing anything wrong here?
got it, thanks.. but in Mark's post (page 4, #113) he's subtracting the formula by 121. any ideia why the 121 specifically?
Thanks
I then ranked the attributes after calculating the attribute weight divided by CA cost.
I think the attribute scores that are above 15 are the ones to use. I have been using the Division average and adding a point or 2 and searching for players. I seem to be getting pretty good players using this approach. My most recent save is tier 8 in the English system. I struggled early and was 6 wins 2 draws and 2 losses after the first 10 games. I restarted the save and bought 10 players using this approach, to cover all outfield positions using ZaZ Blue 4.0. Won the first 10 games.
If you give it a try, please let me know how you go.
Hey @Mark sorry but im feeling quite stupid today