pixar said: This tactic has the same points as "Kickback (Strikerless) V7" but a +3 goal difference better. Why is it in 2nd place? Expand
FM Arena has explained this before. They have run 1350 tests and show a rounded number relating to 38 matches (EPL, Serie A, La Liga). They are sorted by points, so Kickback will be fractionally in front. You can sort by goal difference if that is your preference.
GeorgeFloydOverdosed said: I added match practice to my training regime, but left professionalism as default (realistic luton test).
Result was ST - acc 2.06, pace 2.56
That means match practice can be ruled out as the relevant factor
I also had a look at the players individually and found that the general pattern, while not that consistent, was that it scaled roughly linearly with professionalism, i.e. 15 pro was 77-100% of 20 pro, 10 pro was 40-77% of 20 pro.
I suppose then that [Chance creation + Attacking + Aerial Defense + Handling + Defending from the front + Quickness + Quickness focus] should be used only if you have a squad that is ~16+ professionalism Expand
I noticed in FM24 that there were 6 training routines that used 40% individual training, which I think would remove the need for using physical routines given all the outfield players have Quickness as their individual focus. 2 are GK being Shot Stopping and Handling, 2 defence being Aerial Defence and Ground Defence and 2 are attacking being Chance Creation and Chance Conversion (although these are under Technical). They all also focus on the key attributes for each position.
I am wondering whether one of each of the following would be best and it would certainly lower injuries - Attacking, Defending (given EBFM results), Shot Stopping, Handling, Aerial Defence, Ground Defence, Chance Creation and Chance Conversion. I would run the GK ones on Monday, Attacking and Defending on Tuesday or Wednesday (as it wouldnt hurt to lose these some weeks) depending when your second game usually happens and the other 4 spread across Thursday and Friday. I have started running with this but am just about to finish season one so wont know for a while. Just a theory based on what I have read and some discussion back in FM22 or 23.
lasko911 said: Is this all for FM 24? If so, is there any research applicable to FM 26? Expand
I don't believe there has been changes to the training under the hood for FM26, just presentational.
Based on LXS 41140 but bringing in the Meta defensive shape with 5 at the back and 2 DMs, 2x Wingers and 1x AM.
Tested with a side from each of the 7 English Leagues - EPL down to Enterprise National South, with 6 of them winning and Burley finishing 5th. The screenshots are from Shrewsbury in Sky Bet League 2. Sides were ranked between 14 and 24 in the main with the exception of Ebbsfleet who were ranked 6th. Excluding Burnley, average goals for were 123, against 50 and points 108.
I played the save in holiday mode with no transfers.
These are the best results I have had for a single season testing. I had tried the formation in my current save and it was doing great from the first time I used it which is why I tested it.
Jqg said: Hi, I like to play with two strikers. If I use a tactic like this and replace the attacking midfielders with strikers, does it lose much of its effectiveness, or would it be viable? Expand
It will lose a fair bit, as the best strikerless tactic rates 90, whilst the best 2 striker tactic rates 77. You could try the best 2 striker and maybe change the midfield a little if it was your preference. Here it the best 2 striker tactic ZaZ Winter 0.37.
Based on diaboliq moving the AM to ST. Seems to score more goals and I prefer not using strikerless.
My standard test using one team from each league - EPL down to Enterprise National South. All below EPL got promoted and averaged 99 pts, 108 goals for and 51 goals against. Holiday mode with no transfers.
I have the screenshots from Merthyr in Enterprise National North.
ZaZ said: I tested with my four tactics, and all got a noticeable boost in average points and goal difference. I can only assume it works for any tactic. Expand
Hi @ZaZ is this still your preferred set piece routine after the ME changes?
Trying a version where strikers cant play, 5 at the back and 5 across the centre midfield.
Used the same setup with 1 team in each of the top 7 English Leagues. I noticed all side fell away towards the end, but it was hard to field sides with this structure from the base squads. No transfers and tested on holiday. 3 teams won their Leagues with a 2nd, 3rd, 4th and Bburnley ran 8th.
Most of the teams scored more than 100 goals for the season.
Minor tweak to MDW 523 SS, with the 2 AMs now also SS but PI to stay wide
Tested with same 7 sides, no transfers and using holiday mode, with 5 wins, 1 second and Burnley finishing 5th and into Europe. I chose to show Doncaster this time. Predicted 19th and won the League well
I have updated the MDW 523 to strikerless given the new engine and added a few tweaks from @Gerrard Argus tactic.
Tested with a side from each of the 7 Englisg Leagues, with 6 of them winning and Burley finishing 6th. The screenshots are from Merthyr who were considered the 24th best team at the start df the season rated 300/1. Sides were ranked between 14 and 24 in the main with the exception of Ebbsfleet who were ranked 6th. They are included as I am playing them in my current save.
Hopefully this improves on MDW 523 as it fell down a bit in the new ME.
Yes, there'll be separate tactic testing on the 26.1 update.
We haven't started re-testing tactics for the 26.1 update yet because the FMRTE app still hasn't been updated to support the latest FM 26.1 public update. As soon it gets updated we start testing on the 26.1 update.
As usual, all the tactics in the HoF will be re-tested automatically and tactics outside the HoF can be re-tested via the "re-test request feature" that will be available as soon as we start testing on the 26.1 public update. Expand
Thanks for the response and a big thanks to you and your team for the great work helping us FM fanatics out thru FM Arena.
In general, the game is still in a beta phase and as we can see it gets patches almost on a daily basis so there's no point in testing anything at the moment.
And mostly important, the official pre-game editor hasn't been released yet so we can't start creating our tactic testing league for FM26.
And when the above is solved then of course, it would takes some time to adjust our tactic testing server for FM26 before we start testing tactics for FM26. Expand
Will there be separate tactic testing on the 26.1 update given there were changes to the match engine and if so is there a plan or a process for which tactics get retested?
A small but important tweak to my last tactic, central Striker is now an F9. Lets him drop back and gives him more freedom to roam. Tested as per MDW 523. This time 5 of the 7 sides won their league, Shrewsbury finished 3rd after a string of injuries including their GK, and Burley managed 4th.
I see you finally managed to overcome the bloody "the tactic could not be imported" issue.
What did do? Could be useful for people. Expand
I didnt realise the title had to be the same as the tactic name. I had started new games and even rebuilt the tactic from scratch. still didnt work. So I downloaded the tactic from your site and noticed the tactic name was the same as the title.
I have tried to take the meta defensive approach OOP and add to the meta attacking approach IP. I ran it with 7 sides from EPL down to Enterprise Nth/Sth. All sides were not given much hope. Ended with 2 leagues won, 4 second positions and Burnley finished 11th.
The tests were done on Holiday and no transfer activity.
@Zippo can you please tell us what formations the AI teams use in your test league and what the margin of error is in your current testing using 1350 matches. I would like to be able to look at which tactics work best against each of the top 5 AI tactics and also which tactics are falling within the margin of error of the top tactics for particular formations
I have attempted to blend a few tactics and make the Into the Void tactic into a more plug and play versionincluding some of the features from Winter 0.2. Seemed to go reasonably well with Burnley.
No transfers in, holiday mode and made it into Europe. Final attempt to fix it
FM Arena has explained this before. They have run 1350 tests and show a rounded number relating to 38 matches (EPL, Serie A, La Liga). They are sorted by points, so Kickback will be fractionally in front. You can sort by goal difference if that is your preference.
If you look at the training detail and split. Here are Aerial Defence, Chance Completion and GK Handling breakups:
There main focus is 60% with the secondary and tertiary 40% and all individual focus.
Result was ST - acc 2.06, pace 2.56
That means match practice can be ruled out as the relevant factor
I also had a look at the players individually and found that the general pattern, while not that consistent, was that it scaled roughly linearly with professionalism, i.e. 15 pro was 77-100% of 20 pro, 10 pro was 40-77% of 20 pro.
I suppose then that [Chance creation + Attacking + Aerial Defense + Handling + Defending from the front + Quickness + Quickness focus] should be used only if you have a squad that is ~16+ professionalism
I noticed in FM24 that there were 6 training routines that used 40% individual training, which I think would remove the need for using physical routines given all the outfield players have Quickness as their individual focus. 2 are GK being Shot Stopping and Handling, 2 defence being Aerial Defence and Ground Defence and 2 are attacking being Chance Creation and Chance Conversion (although these are under Technical). They all also focus on the key attributes for each position.
I am wondering whether one of each of the following would be best and it would certainly lower injuries - Attacking, Defending (given EBFM results), Shot Stopping, Handling, Aerial Defence, Ground Defence, Chance Creation and Chance Conversion. I would run the GK ones on Monday, Attacking and Defending on Tuesday or Wednesday (as it wouldnt hurt to lose these some weeks) depending when your second game usually happens and the other 4 spread across Thursday and Friday. I have started running with this but am just about to finish season one so wont know for a while. Just a theory based on what I have read and some discussion back in FM22 or 23.
lasko911 said: Is this all for FM 24? If so, is there any research applicable to FM 26?
I don't believe there has been changes to the training under the hood for FM26, just presentational.
Tested with a side from each of the 7 English Leagues - EPL down to Enterprise National South, with 6 of them winning and Burley finishing 5th. The screenshots are from Shrewsbury in Sky Bet League 2. Sides were ranked between 14 and 24 in the main with the exception of Ebbsfleet who were ranked 6th. Excluding Burnley, average goals for were 123, against 50 and points 108.
I played the save in holiday mode with no transfers.
These are the best results I have had for a single season testing. I had tried the formation in my current save and it was doing great from the first time I used it which is why I tested it.
I dont really have time at the moment. Maybe in the new year
It will lose a fair bit, as the best strikerless tactic rates 90, whilst the best 2 striker tactic rates 77. You could try the best 2 striker and maybe change the midfield a little if it was your preference. Here it the best 2 striker tactic ZaZ Winter 0.37.
My standard test using one team from each league - EPL down to Enterprise National South. All below EPL got promoted and averaged 99 pts, 108 goals for and 51 goals against. Holiday mode with no transfers.
I have the screenshots from Merthyr in Enterprise National North.
Hi @ZaZ is this still your preferred set piece routine after the ME changes?
Used the same setup with 1 team in each of the top 7 English Leagues. I noticed all side fell away towards the end, but it was hard to field sides with this structure from the base squads. No transfers and tested on holiday. 3 teams won their Leagues with a 2nd, 3rd, 4th and Bburnley ran 8th.
Most of the teams scored more than 100 goals for the season.
Tested with same 7 sides, no transfers and using holiday mode, with 5 wins, 1 second and Burnley finishing 5th and into Europe. I chose to show Doncaster this time. Predicted 19th and won the League well
Tested with a side from each of the 7 Englisg Leagues, with 6 of them winning and Burley finishing 6th. The screenshots are from Merthyr who were considered the 24th best team at the start df the season rated 300/1. Sides were ranked between 14 and 24 in the main with the exception of Ebbsfleet who were ranked 6th. They are included as I am playing them in my current save.
Hopefully this improves on MDW 523 as it fell down a bit in the new ME.
Yes, there'll be separate tactic testing on the 26.1 update.
We haven't started re-testing tactics for the 26.1 update yet because the FMRTE app still hasn't been updated to support the latest FM 26.1 public update. As soon it gets updated we start testing on the 26.1 update.
As usual, all the tactics in the HoF will be re-tested automatically and tactics outside the HoF can be re-tested via the "re-test request feature" that will be available as soon as we start testing on the 26.1 public update.
Thanks for the response and a big thanks to you and your team for the great work helping us FM fanatics out thru FM Arena.
In general, the game is still in a beta phase and as we can see it gets patches almost on a daily basis so there's no point in testing anything at the moment.
And mostly important, the official pre-game editor hasn't been released yet so we can't start creating our tactic testing league for FM26.
And when the above is solved then of course, it would takes some time to adjust our tactic testing server for FM26 before we start testing tactics for FM26.
Will there be separate tactic testing on the 26.1 update given there were changes to the match engine and if so is there a plan or a process for which tactics get retested?
Looking forward to the test
I see you finally managed to overcome the bloody "the tactic could not be imported" issue.
What did do? Could be useful for people.
I didnt realise the title had to be the same as the tactic name. I had started new games and even rebuilt the tactic from scratch. still didnt work. So I downloaded the tactic from your site and noticed the tactic name was the same as the title.
My fault. Thanks so much for your help
The tests were done on Holiday and no transfer activity.
Seems to be going ok.
Thanks
No transfers in, holiday mode and made it into Europe. Final attempt to fix it