Luisinho said: You didn't say anything wrong mate, I can't understand those exaggerated reactions. Internet is going really crazy nowdays. Expand
It's hard to understand what people mean without voice intonation and face expressions. Also, this whole Knap thing must have stressed the guy a lot these days. I hope things cool down so people can go back to treating this as just a hobby.
Liam said: They don't get any priority! Currently, our queue selects tactics totally from random due to the nature of working with two different website/platforms. In the future, it will test in the order of the uploads. Hope that clears that up. The only reason more of Knap's were tested, is because he had over 200 uploaded, out of a total of 700~. Expand
Egraam said: It's only natural, that if they pick tactics at random, and there are so many Knap tactics, that some of his tactics will be tested first - it's simple probability.
I use both sites, both sites use different methods of testing, and both sites are testing the tactics entirely for free, benefiting the FM community. No need to be unnecessarily hostile by throwing accusations. Expand
I believe he just meant that his tactics get priority, which would be natural with an agreement. No need to escalate things. Both sites have done a great deal of work to the community and deserve respect. I don't think anyone doubt their methods of testing, this looks just like a misunderstanding.
Mark said: @ZaZ All the numbers are average points per game. The top ranked sides and low ranked sides were determined using FM Scout when the game was first saved. So low ranked sides were expected to be relegated and top ranked sides to be promoted. Non League sides are Vanarama leagues. Hope that helps Expand
Those are awesome results, then. I suppose it will get more even when all tactics are tested against all sets of tests. I still expect Blue 2.0 to have an edge, though.
P.S.: Can you please explain what the stats mean? What are they and how to read it? Is higher or lower better in each of them? (P.S.2: I believe it's average points with top team and low team, but no idea what non league sides mean.)
healmuth said: freakin done with Knap and his shit this year. He's always been a multi-tactic guy but man his freaking 50 releases a day is a joke. Expand
Worsr part is that because of his tactic spam, other people can't have their tactics tested. For example, I posted my Blue 2.0 at fm-base one week ago, but there is a queue with 100 tactics from knap before they even think about testing it.
Mark Tighter said: I don't think he rigs, he simply always uses Liverpool, the strongest team in the Premier League and probably the strongest team in the whole game. It takes a really awful tactic for not winning with Liverpool. Expand
Maybe you are right, or maybe he tests with maximum condition, morale and tactical familiarity, as well as selecting the team manually. Anyway, it surprises me that none of his tactics was good in this patch.
Nothing against the topic starter, but I am getting a bit tired of so many"Knap cool name 300points with Liverpool all cups". I mean, the guy has the same results for all possible formations, in all variations. I am starting to think he rigs the results somehow.
ta2199 said: Try this one: Change SS to CM(At) ( with all PIs) Mentality to Attacking Expand
Just tested three times. It looks slightly worse to me, specially with weak team. Also, gonna start testing in 5 leagues at once, with best and worse predicted teams. Germany, England, Spain, France and Italy.
ta2199 said: Try this one: Change SS to CM(At) ( with all PIs) Mentality to Attacking Expand
I am quite sure I tried that before with positive mentality and it was about the same. Let me try with attacking and very attacking since the CM might provide some defense stability.
ta2199 said: Yeah, I Just do that when i really need a goal Expand
My plan is to develop a variant of Blue 2.0 for when you want to hold a score (park the bus) and another when you are desperate for a score. Right now, it seems like just changing the mentality to cautious and very attacking can do the trick, but I am checking if there are better options. In any case, I would recommend training the tactics with those mentalities to make sure the players have enough tactical familiarity to make them perform well.
Mark said: I like the idea of having a good park the bus tactic @ZaZ. I have just been changing mentality to cautious on ZaZ Blue 2.0. You might want to try it as the benchmark. Expand
I tried different mentalities to see which would work better. Cautious gave me the following results:
It's definitely better defensively, taking around 2/3 of the goals from Blue 2.0. I am still checking if I can improve this, as well as reduce the intensity to rest players and avoid injuries.
ta2199 said: Instead, Change MR/ML to AMR/L and changed them to IW(Su) Early Result but look good Expand
Gonna try it later. Didn't see IW working in this patch yet, but it would be nice if it did.
P.S.: It seems to work surprisingly well. I am running a second test to see if it was a fluke. I tried it before to change wingers by something else, since very few of my goals happen from crosses. However, I didn't try Inverted Wingers since all tactics with them was performing really weak. I will check if IW is better as ML or AML, then compare with DW and see if it's an improvement. Thanks for the tip.
P.S.2: IW as AML/AMR is better than IW as ML/MR. However, it doesn't seem as stable as DW. I am not saying it's worse, but it doesn't seem better either, so I won't test any further, since I am testing in another direction (park the bus).
And again all kudos to you for creating the best tactic in the game Expand
Haha, thanks for the words. I don't think my tactic is better or worse than the top, but I'd say I am proud of it. Now I plan to make a defensive tactic to minimize goals against, to be used when you have a good lead and want to avoid a comeback. I am aiming for a tactic that can take less than 15 goals in the entire season in a holiday test, even if it doesn't win the league.
This is Blue 3.0, a high intensity tactic that I have been using with great success. Other people have also tried it and confirmed the efficiency, consistently delivering good results with very entertaining football, from semi-professional teams to the crowd favorites. Without further ado, here is the tactic. Since some people on consoles were asking for the team instructions, they are presented below. Spoiler
The formation is a 4-4-2 with Shadow Strikers instead of conventional forwards. When in possession, the Inverted Wing Backs become midfielders and the Central Midfielder becomes an attacker, working effectively as a 2-5-3. The Central Midfielder and Shadow Strikers score the majority of goals, while the assists are evenly distributed among all players, mainly using through balls to the center.
For player instructions, all player have Get Further Forward, Dribble More, Shoot Less Often, Take More Risks and Tackle Harder (except goalkeeper), when available. Other than that, Ball Playing Defenders get Stay Wider, Central Midfield gets Move Into Channels and Defensive Wingers get Cross From Byline.
There are no opponent instructions or set piece takers, and wingers should have the same foot as their side. Feel free to change DW for W or DLP to DM if it fits your taste, since it makes little difference as long as you keep the player instructions.
Here are the results of a holiday test with Manchester City and Fulham, predicted 1st and 20th respectively. Manchester City also won the UCL. The stats of Best XI (picked by assistant manager) and performance analysis are also below.
My training schedules are available below. In-Season is focused in increasing chance of winning during current season, including attacking movements, defensive position and teamwork for next match bonuses, quickness for most important attributes, match practice and team bonding for happiness and cohesion, and recovery to prevent injuries. There is also a schedule for two matches, with lighter training so the best eleven can be used in both matches. Pre-Season focuses in quickness for most important attributes and endurance to improve condition and avoid injuries during season, with one friendly per week (I also usually do pre-season in double intensity). Move training sessions if your match days are different and use friendlies on reserve/youth team to keep secondary squad players fit. I always set up position training to tactic role and individual training to quickness (or GK reactions).
Below are the training schedules for those on consoles. Spoiler
Pre-Season In-Season, one and two matches. For two matches, I left training light since some people like to play the best eleven in every match.
Below are the set pieces, for those on consoles. They are a tweak from set pieces from earlier versions of Blue, Void from @Cyborg, Motion from @Egraam and Phoenix from @Magician. More information in this thread. Spoiler
Against stronger teams, a good trick is to start the match with Cautious mentality (Solid Blue), then change back to Positive (Blue 3.0) or Very Attacking (Dark Blue 3.0) on the second half. It works because players from stronger teams crack down at half time when not winning, or get complacent when winning even by one goal. Then you can surprise them and snatch a win while their performance goes down. Against weaker teams, it's often better to just start with Very Attacking mentality. If you are also training Light Blue and Dark Blue, the change in mentality won't affect your tactical affinity.
In my case, I usually train three tactics: Blue 3.0, Solid Blue 3.0 and Light Blue 3.0. I use Blue to maximize my chance to win, Solid Blue to minimize goals conceded and Light Blue to save energy and avoid bookings. As a basic rule, I use Blue by default, Solid Blue when winning by two goals and Light Blue when winning by three or more. Against stronger teams, I use Solid Blue in the first half, then Blue in the second half, as described in the above paragraph.
Changes V2.1 - Improved set pieces
V2.2 - Added Use Tighter Marking
V3.0 - Removed Use Tighter Marking
Leave a comment below if you liked the tactic and make sure to share your results. Enjoy!
- Use Light Blue 3.0 when you have a comfortable lead. It's a tactic developed to concede less goals, receive less cards and save some energy, at the cost of less scoring opportunities. - If your only objective is to concede less goals, then use Solid Blue 3.0. It's Blue 3.0 with cautious mentality and Slow Pace Down, so it defends better without decreasing your chance of winning. - Use Dark Blue 3.0 when you are desperate for goals. It's Blue 3.0 with very attacking mentality.
I would be joking if I said this was not the best tactic I have ever used, my first season with Benfica I have not conceded a goal yet in the first 10 league matches also unbeaten with a group of Bayern and Lazio, we beat Bayern 6-0 at home.
this tactic makes FM 21 feel easy Expand
Thank you for testing. I will do like you suggested and post Blue 2.0 on fm-base. Gonna create a more descriptive post to explain how the tactic works and what kind of players are expected to it. Then I will also copy the more descriptive topic here.
kireby said: Understood, last question, do you buy strikers (ofc with pass, off the ball etc) and teach team SS or AMC? From my experience, the best goalscorers were AMC Expand
I do both if the stats are good. However, AMC usually are better because they get Forward attributes for a cheaper cost, since each position has different weights for attributes.
kireby said: Haha, looks like this. Btw, Messi is the Head of Youth Development in Almeria, lol. Can you help to understand why some players at SS scoring every match while others even who have good shooting are absolutely crap scoring near 5-7 goals per season. Expand
To be honest, it can be many different things. One SS can be worse than the other (low Off The Ball and Anticipation, maybe). Maybe one winger is worse and more assists happen from one side. Maybe the SS is in a horrible form, which can last a long time in this match engine. Maybe he gets tired or injuried too often. Maybe one of the SS is good at passing and often think it's better to pass than shoot, making the other score more. Maybe he always cuts outside and has a foot that favours crossing instead of shooting. As you can see, there are too many possible causes. It's hard to know. With me, goals are pretty evenly distributed.
kireby said: @ZaZ We finally becoming something more than just a team of fools in Europe. Won Barca two times, Juventus, lost to Ajax 2 times though.. But we could do more already 3-4 seasons ago if Russian champion would be in 1st pot at UCL draw, we always in 4th pot Expand
After Messi and CR retired it got easier, right? Just kidding, good job there! I wonder how much weaker you are than those teams you started to beat.
It's hard to understand what people mean without voice intonation and face expressions. Also, this whole Knap thing must have stressed the guy a lot these days. I hope things cool down so people can go back to treating this as just a hobby.
Thank you for the hard work at the platform.
I use both sites, both sites use different methods of testing, and both sites are testing the tactics entirely for free, benefiting the FM community. No need to be unnecessarily hostile by throwing accusations.
I believe he just meant that his tactics get priority, which would be natural with an agreement. No need to escalate things. Both sites have done a great deal of work to the community and deserve respect. I don't think anyone doubt their methods of testing, this looks just like a misunderstanding.
Those are awesome results, then. I suppose it will get more even when all tactics are tested against all sets of tests. I still expect Blue 2.0 to have an edge, though.
I second this question. This was by far the worst change of this version.
P.S.: After so many positive tests, I changed the main post to make sure people know 2.0 is better.
P.S.: Can you please explain what the stats mean? What are they and how to read it? Is higher or lower better in each of them? (P.S.2: I believe it's average points with top team and low team, but no idea what non league sides mean.)
Worsr part is that because of his tactic spam, other people can't have their tactics tested. For example, I posted my Blue 2.0 at fm-base one week ago, but there is a queue with 100 tactics from knap before they even think about testing it.
Maybe you are right, or maybe he tests with maximum condition, morale and tactical familiarity, as well as selecting the team manually. Anyway, it surprises me that none of his tactics was good in this patch.
Change SS to CM(At) ( with all PIs)
Mentality to Attacking
Just tested three times. It looks slightly worse to me, specially with weak team. Also, gonna start testing in 5 leagues at once, with best and worse predicted teams. Germany, England, Spain, France and Italy.
Change SS to CM(At) ( with all PIs)
Mentality to Attacking
I am quite sure I tried that before with positive mentality and it was about the same. Let me try with attacking and very attacking since the CM might provide some defense stability.
My plan is to develop a variant of Blue 2.0 for when you want to hold a score (park the bus) and another when you are desperate for a score. Right now, it seems like just changing the mentality to cautious and very attacking can do the trick, but I am checking if there are better options. In any case, I would recommend training the tactics with those mentalities to make sure the players have enough tactical familiarity to make them perform well.
I tried different mentalities to see which would work better. Cautious gave me the following results:
It's definitely better defensively, taking around 2/3 of the goals from Blue 2.0. I am still checking if I can improve this, as well as reduce the intensity to rest players and avoid injuries.
ta2199 said: Instead, Change MR/ML to AMR/L and changed them to IW(Su)
Early Result but look good
Gonna try it later. Didn't see IW working in this patch yet, but it would be nice if it did.
P.S.: It seems to work surprisingly well. I am running a second test to see if it was a fluke. I tried it before to change wingers by something else, since very few of my goals happen from crosses. However, I didn't try Inverted Wingers since all tactics with them was performing really weak. I will check if IW is better as ML or AML, then compare with DW and see if it's an improvement. Thanks for the tip.
P.S.2: IW as AML/AMR is better than IW as ML/MR. However, it doesn't seem as stable as DW. I am not saying it's worse, but it doesn't seem better either, so I won't test any further, since I am testing in another direction (park the bus).
And again all kudos to you for creating the best tactic in the game
Haha, thanks for the words. I don't think my tactic is better or worse than the top, but I'd say I am proud of it. Now I plan to make a defensive tactic to minimize goals against, to be used when you have a good lead and want to avoid a comeback. I am aiming for a tactic that can take less than 15 goals in the entire season in a holiday test, even if it doesn't win the league.
Since some people on consoles were asking for the team instructions, they are presented below.
Spoiler
The formation is a 4-4-2 with Shadow Strikers instead of conventional forwards. When in possession, the Inverted Wing Backs become midfielders and the Central Midfielder becomes an attacker, working effectively as a 2-5-3. The Central Midfielder and Shadow Strikers score the majority of goals, while the assists are evenly distributed among all players, mainly using through balls to the center.
For player instructions, all player have Get Further Forward, Dribble More, Shoot Less Often, Take More Risks and Tackle Harder (except goalkeeper), when available. Other than that, Ball Playing Defenders get Stay Wider, Central Midfield gets Move Into Channels and Defensive Wingers get Cross From Byline.
There are no opponent instructions or set piece takers, and wingers should have the same foot as their side. Feel free to change DW for W or DLP to DM if it fits your taste, since it makes little difference as long as you keep the player instructions.
Main attributes for players are Pace and Acceleration. Agility and Dribbling come next in importance. More information in the link below.
https://fm-arena.com/table/9-important-attributes/
Here are the results of a holiday test with Manchester City and Fulham, predicted 1st and 20th respectively. Manchester City also won the UCL. The stats of Best XI (picked by assistant manager) and performance analysis are also below.
My training schedules are available below. In-Season is focused in increasing chance of winning during current season, including attacking movements, defensive position and teamwork for next match bonuses, quickness for most important attributes, match practice and team bonding for happiness and cohesion, and recovery to prevent injuries. There is also a schedule for two matches, with lighter training so the best eleven can be used in both matches. Pre-Season focuses in quickness for most important attributes and endurance to improve condition and avoid injuries during season, with one friendly per week (I also usually do pre-season in double intensity). Move training sessions if your match days are different and use friendlies on reserve/youth team to keep secondary squad players fit. I always set up position training to tactic role and individual training to quickness (or GK reactions).
Below are the training schedules for those on consoles.
Spoiler Pre-Season
In-Season, one and two matches. For two matches, I left training light since some people like to play the best eleven in every match.
Below are the set pieces, for those on consoles. They are a tweak from set pieces from earlier versions of Blue, Void from @Cyborg, Motion from @Egraam and Phoenix from @Magician. More information in this thread.
Spoiler
Against stronger teams, a good trick is to start the match with Cautious mentality (Solid Blue), then change back to Positive (Blue 3.0) or Very Attacking (Dark Blue 3.0) on the second half. It works because players from stronger teams crack down at half time when not winning, or get complacent when winning even by one goal. Then you can surprise them and snatch a win while their performance goes down. Against weaker teams, it's often better to just start with Very Attacking mentality. If you are also training Light Blue and Dark Blue, the change in mentality won't affect your tactical affinity.
In my case, I usually train three tactics: Blue 3.0, Solid Blue 3.0 and Light Blue 3.0. I use Blue to maximize my chance to win, Solid Blue to minimize goals conceded and Light Blue to save energy and avoid bookings. As a basic rule, I use Blue by default, Solid Blue when winning by two goals and Light Blue when winning by three or more. Against stronger teams, I use Solid Blue in the first half, then Blue in the second half, as described in the above paragraph.
Changes
V2.1
- Improved set pieces
V2.2
- Added Use Tighter Marking
V3.0
- Removed Use Tighter Marking
Leave a comment below if you liked the tactic and make sure to share your results. Enjoy!
- Use Light Blue 3.0 when you have a comfortable lead. It's a tactic developed to concede less goals, receive less cards and save some energy, at the cost of less scoring opportunities.
- If your only objective is to concede less goals, then use Solid Blue 3.0. It's Blue 3.0 with cautious mentality and Slow Pace Down, so it defends better without decreasing your chance of winning.
- Use Dark Blue 3.0 when you are desperate for goals. It's Blue 3.0 with very attacking mentality.
I would be joking if I said this was not the best tactic I have ever used, my first season with Benfica I have not conceded a goal yet in the first 10 league matches also unbeaten with a group of Bayern and Lazio, we beat Bayern 6-0 at home.
this tactic makes FM 21 feel easy
Thank you for testing. I will do like you suggested and post Blue 2.0 on fm-base. Gonna create a more descriptive post to explain how the tactic works and what kind of players are expected to it. Then I will also copy the more descriptive topic here.
P.S.: Done.
From my experience, the best goalscorers were AMC
I do both if the stats are good. However, AMC usually are better because they get Forward attributes for a cheaper cost, since each position has different weights for attributes.
P.S.: This dude will score like crazy!
Can you help to understand why some players at SS scoring every match while others even who have good shooting are absolutely crap scoring near 5-7 goals per season.
To be honest, it can be many different things. One SS can be worse than the other (low Off The Ball and Anticipation, maybe). Maybe one winger is worse and more assists happen from one side. Maybe the SS is in a horrible form, which can last a long time in this match engine. Maybe he gets tired or injuried too often. Maybe one of the SS is good at passing and often think it's better to pass than shoot, making the other score more. Maybe he always cuts outside and has a foot that favours crossing instead of shooting. As you can see, there are too many possible causes. It's hard to know. With me, goals are pretty evenly distributed.
After Messi and CR retired it got easier, right? Just kidding, good job there! I wonder how much weaker you are than those teams you started to beat.