Tejash said: Thank you, but 13 losses for a top tactic is a bit too much Expand
Sorry to hear that, I don't know why it's not working for your Arsenal. It seems to work well for other people and even the assistant manager, so I got no clue what's going on there.
gaohaoqing said: hello.i hava a problem： What do green and orange mean ？ Expand
Colors. They are just identifiers for tactics, so I focus on upgrading those tactics instead of creating new ones. For example, Yellow is my tactic with three defenders (343), while Orange is my tactic with three strikers (433). Blue is supposed to be a balanced tactic (442), while Green was my tactic with advanced wingers. Some of those I will work deeper later, while others will be dropped because of low performance.
Tejash said: I have never played on holiday as I like to micromanage the club always, if I may ask how many matches would you give for the results to show? Its basically plug n play only right just like your earlier tactics?? Expand
Yeah, it is supposed to be plug and play. I also recommend to use fast players instead of slow ones.
Tejash said: Still aint working...10th in the league with Arsenal mid season. Do you use OI's or leave it to AM? Expand
I don't use OI. I don't know why it's not working there. Have you tried going in holiday (marking option to use current tactic) and seeing if assistant manager also does badly?
Kyle said: 3 and 5 you can achieve in pre season. 2 is a negative. 1 yeah I thought that but not always important either. 4 what are the match bonuses and how do I achieve them? Expand
Sane said: @ZaZ How do you think this tactic is better than fanecas? Here are the differences between snow halation v3 tactics and Fanecas
1) IWB-At 2) DW-Su 3) One Pf, one AF 4) Or Positive mentality? Expand
More like a combination, to be honest. Positive with DW makes it more stable in the back while IWB-At makes it better in attack. I am not sure if PF makes much of a difference, so I can't talk about it.
Keep in mind that the difference between those two tactics is negligible and could very much fall under the precision range of these tests (5-7%), with 0.036 points per match. In a season of 38 matches, that would be less than 2 points. To be fair, the difference to Orange is not so big either, we can only assume it's better because the goal difference is clearly superior.
BiTeL33T said: i mean its good, in my testing fiorentina did 67 points which is not far off but in comparison ZaZ - Red 0.2 had 86 points so it was quite a bit better Expand
The same test with the same tactic can have lots of variation, over 10 points higher or lower. I wouldn't say one is better than the other based in one test only for each. It might be that Red is better for Fiorentina, but it's hard to say just by a single result.
BiTeL33T said: i´ve done a test save with fiorentina and results were very poor aswell, maybe its a tactic for top teams Expand
Tejash said: Another loss mate, 16th in the league now. Can't continue like this.. Dunno whats wrong, Im gonna restart a new career and let you know. But this time if it fails..I think we need to redo the testing bruh. I noticed the tactic was leaking goals causing the loss...the earlier number 1 was much stable though Expand
Test with Fiorentina and Arsenal, full holiday mode, assistant manager picked the teams.
Results should be better than this for a human manager.
Gaksital said: WelI... i haven't used all your tactics, but I generally agree with most of your tactical instructions to victories. I just wanted to applaud your many such attempts and outstanding competencies. I'm always thankful. Expand
Thank you so much!
About being original in this game, it gets harder and harder the close you get to the top, because some instructions and formations simply work well while others just don't work at all. The higher the score, the harder to get away from that set of best instructions and formations. That's why I'm so happy we have such a good variety of formations with 5.8+ score, because in FM21, the best tactic with three defenders was 0.5 points behind the best.
Gaksital said: He wouldn't have done it on purpose. However, among the best tactics on this site, there are always many outstanding tactics by Zaz. so I think it's not bad to always be careful.
Zaz's tactical direction is always correct and outstanding, but I hope there will be more new creative attempts. Expand
Haha, I wouldn't say my directions are always correct. I just test a lot, so I get some hints of what usually works and what doesn't. I'm happy enough that there are different shapes with good results this year, be it with three defenders, three strikers or the basic 442.
I guess I copied other people's tactics to improve my rating.
We will make sure these things never happen again. Expand
It's fine, I don't mind it at all! I'm actually grateful that people use my tactics as a base because it gives me hints on how to improve, or gives me the freedom to explore other paths. Anyway, just make sure to give credits when it's too close to the base, because people put lots of effot to get something good.
Most tactics start using something as a base, be another tactic from FM or from real life, then change slowly with time until become something unique. Blue, for example, started using Duke and Gunslinger as baseline, going through lots of versions until the final version from FM21. Another example is the set pieces, which started taking routines from previous versions of Blue, Phoenix, Void and Motion, then got adjusted until I got the best results.
Tejash said: since its the number one and since i trust ZAZ let me try the whole season and get back to you..but for now it seems OFF Expand
For reference, my teams always do bad in the first few matches, then start long undefeated sequences. Give it a bit more time and remember to rotate the team and keep morale high, so you don't run out of fuel by the end of season.
Kyle said: I can understand it probably has an effect on development, but curious about specifically performance. I personally never setup general training and honestly with the way gegenpress works now I just send my players on rest between games which seems to avoid injuries (most seem to happen in training) and doesn't seem to have an effect on the teams performance. I'm curious if this has ever been tested or if anyone knows either way. Expand
Training can affect performance in several ways: 1. It increases attributes. 2. It affects condition, fatigue and injuries. 3. It can increase cohesion and happiness. 4. It can give next match bonuses. 5. It can increase tactical familiarity.
RalfRangnick said: I don't know what the problem is. Maybe my players are too weak Expand
You are using a different tactic. If your team doesn't have much stamina (usually common in weaker teams), consider lowering tempo by one tick, as well as pressing intensity.
dakka said: have you tried IWB -> WB to help cross ball from wing? Expand
Not with this formation, but it's in the pipeline to be tested.
Tejash said: Is it really the number one? Ive lost first two games at home using this tactic.. Expand
It's hard to know the reason without more info. If your team is underdog in the league, consider lowering tempo by one tick, as well as pressing intensity. That might help a bit if your players don't have much stamina.
It's about time to start experimenting with set pieces. I'm creating this thread so people can share routines and results. If anyone wants to help, I would recommend to follow these guidelines:
1. You can use any editor data for that (or none at all). I would recommend setting consistency and important matches of all players in the league to 20, and injury proneness to 1. My editor data is attached to this post.
2. Create a new game with the teams you want to use for testing (remember to disable first season transfers). Save a backup file on the very first day. My save file is attached here (can't attach to the post because it's over 20 mb).
3. Run my set pieces first and save results to use as reference. I am attaching three tactics with the same set pieces and different formations to this post (343 defenders, 433 strikers or 442). The positions got a bit messed up in FM-Arena table (because of me testing different shapes), but I fixed it properly now. I use Orange 1.0 for reference, which is the new name of Orange SS.
4. For each experiment, set up the same tactic with the desired routines, then go in vacation until the end of season (330 days on English Premier League), marking the option to use current tactics. Use the same save for all tests. I usually run three to five times, but feel free to use any methodology of testing you want.
5. The most important data to share are total points in the league (or points per match) and goal difference. If you want, you can also provide data from league > stats > team detailed > goals/conceded from corners, direct free kicks and indirect free kicks. For throw ins, the relevant data is in data hub > team > report > scoring/conceding > assists (it usually won't show anything since it's common to get 0 assists from throw ins).
You can also help with suggestions of routines to be tested.
Metal said: Unbelievable work zaz your tactic is everything I wanted my tactic that I was working on to be.
It's ridiculous attacking, so dominating and endless goals no matter who the opposition.
It can't be bested or tweaked better imo, you done the best 433 which is my favourite formation. I was close to finding the formula with the shape but you nailed the instructions and set pieces
Here's some results Expand
Thanks! I think it still has space to improve a bit, and things can also change after next ME. I'm already pretty satisfied to reach 6+, though.
Nebuuuu said: Now trying with a fresh Start for my Hertha BSC team. It`s a middleclass team (@FM, not irl kekw), will edit and show Screens etc. Thx alot for your engagement again@ZaZ
//EDIT 1st testmatch pre-season..sometimes i just hate the FM. Expand
From what I've played with this tactic, when you lose, you really want to kick the ass of your blind players.
Sorry to hear that, I don't know why it's not working for your Arsenal. It seems to work well for other people and even the assistant manager, so I got no clue what's going on there.
What do green and orange mean ？
Colors. They are just identifiers for tactics, so I focus on upgrading those tactics instead of creating new ones. For example, Yellow is my tactic with three defenders (343), while Orange is my tactic with three strikers (433). Blue is supposed to be a balanced tactic (442), while Green was my tactic with advanced wingers. Some of those I will work deeper later, while others will be dropped because of low performance.
Tejash said: I have never played on holiday as I like to micromanage the club always, if I may ask how many matches would you give for the results to show? Its basically plug n play only right just like your earlier tactics??
Yeah, it is supposed to be plug and play. I also recommend to use fast players instead of slow ones.
I don't use OI. I don't know why it's not working there. Have you tried going in holiday (marking option to use current tactic) and seeing if assistant manager also does badly?
Match preparation or set pieces.
1) IWB-At
2) DW-Su
3) One Pf, one AF
4) Or Positive mentality?
More like a combination, to be honest. Positive with DW makes it more stable in the back while IWB-At makes it better in attack. I am not sure if PF makes much of a difference, so I can't talk about it.
Keep in mind that the difference between those two tactics is negligible and could very much fall under the precision range of these tests (5-7%), with 0.036 points per match. In a season of 38 matches, that would be less than 2 points. To be fair, the difference to Orange is not so big either, we can only assume it's better because the goal difference is clearly superior.
The same test with the same tactic can have lots of variation, over 10 points higher or lower. I wouldn't say one is better than the other based in one test only for each. It might be that Red is better for Fiorentina, but it's hard to say just by a single result.
Tejash said: Another loss mate, 16th in the league now. Can't continue like this.. Dunno whats wrong, Im gonna restart a new career and let you know. But this time if it fails..I think we need to redo the testing bruh. I noticed the tactic was leaking goals causing the loss...the earlier number 1 was much stable though
Test with Fiorentina and Arsenal, full holiday mode, assistant manager picked the teams.
Results should be better than this for a human manager.
or put dlp alittle bit forward to the mid of the centre circle？
I'll take some time to play with the roles of AM, STs and IWB.
I just wanted to applaud your many such attempts and outstanding competencies. I'm always thankful.
Thank you so much!
About being original in this game, it gets harder and harder the close you get to the top, because some instructions and formations simply work well while others just don't work at all. The higher the score, the harder to get away from that set of best instructions and formations. That's why I'm so happy we have such a good variety of formations with 5.8+ score, because in FM21, the best tactic with three defenders was 0.5 points behind the best.
It should work well with the likes of Arsenal and Fiorentina. Let me run a test to see how it performs for both those teams.
However, among the best tactics on this site, there are always many outstanding tactics by Zaz. so I think it's not bad to always be careful.
Zaz's tactical direction is always correct and outstanding, but I hope there will be more new creative attempts.
Haha, I wouldn't say my directions are always correct. I just test a lot, so I get some hints of what usually works and what doesn't. I'm happy enough that there are different shapes with good results this year, be it with three defenders, three strikers or the basic 442.
I guess I copied other people's tactics to improve my rating.
We will make sure these things never happen again.
It's fine, I don't mind it at all! I'm actually grateful that people use my tactics as a base because it gives me hints on how to improve, or gives me the freedom to explore other paths. Anyway, just make sure to give credits when it's too close to the base, because people put lots of effot to get something good.
Most tactics start using something as a base, be another tactic from FM or from real life, then change slowly with time until become something unique. Blue, for example, started using Duke and Gunslinger as baseline, going through lots of versions until the final version from FM21. Another example is the set pieces, which started taking routines from previous versions of Blue, Phoenix, Void and Motion, then got adjusted until I got the best results.
Best of luck there!
For reference, my teams always do bad in the first few matches, then start long undefeated sequences. Give it a bit more time and remember to rotate the team and keep morale high, so you don't run out of fuel by the end of season.
P.S.: Let us know if it got better.
Training can affect performance in several ways:
1. It increases attributes.
2. It affects condition, fatigue and injuries.
3. It can increase cohesion and happiness.
4. It can give next match bonuses.
5. It can increase tactical familiarity.
You are using a different tactic. If your team doesn't have much stamina (usually common in weaker teams), consider lowering tempo by one tick, as well as pressing intensity.
dakka said: have you tried IWB -> WB
to help cross ball from wing?
Not with this formation, but it's in the pipeline to be tested.
Tejash said: Is it really the number one? Ive lost first two games at home using this tactic..
It's hard to know the reason without more info. If your team is underdog in the league, consider lowering tempo by one tick, as well as pressing intensity. That might help a bit if your players don't have much stamina.
Also, there are dozens of reasons that could cause a team to lose. You might even have lost it with any other tactic. Can you provide more info, please? Also, make sure to check https://fm-arena.com/thread/1076-my-tactic-doesn-t-work-help-me-please/.
1. You can use any editor data for that (or none at all). I would recommend setting consistency and important matches of all players in the league to 20, and injury proneness to 1. My editor data is attached to this post.
2. Create a new game with the teams you want to use for testing (remember to disable first season transfers). Save a backup file on the very first day. My save file is attached here (can't attach to the post because it's over 20 mb).
3. Run my set pieces first and save results to use as reference. I am attaching three tactics with the same set pieces and different formations to this post (343 defenders, 433 strikers or 442). The positions got a bit messed up in FM-Arena table (because of me testing different shapes), but I fixed it properly now. I use Orange 1.0 for reference, which is the new name of Orange SS.
4. For each experiment, set up the same tactic with the desired routines, then go in vacation until the end of season (330 days on English Premier League), marking the option to use current tactics. Use the same save for all tests. I usually run three to five times, but feel free to use any methodology of testing you want.
5. The most important data to share are total points in the league (or points per match) and goal difference. If you want, you can also provide data from league > stats > team detailed > goals/conceded from corners, direct free kicks and indirect free kicks. For throw ins, the relevant data is in data hub > team > report > scoring/conceding > assists (it usually won't show anything since it's common to get 0 assists from throw ins).
You can also help with suggestions of routines to be tested.
@Mark
Note: If you use my save file, I believe you don't need to download the editor data.
It's ridiculous attacking, so dominating and endless goals no matter who the opposition.
It can't be bested or tweaked better imo, you done the best 433 which is my favourite formation. I was close to finding the formula with the shape but you nailed the instructions and set pieces
Here's some results
Thanks! I think it still has space to improve a bit, and things can also change after next ME. I'm already pretty satisfied to reach 6+, though.
Nebuuuu said: Now trying with a fresh Start for my Hertha BSC team. It`s a middleclass team (@FM, not irl kekw), will edit and show Screens etc. Thx alot for your engagement again@ZaZ
//EDIT
1st testmatch pre-season..sometimes i just hate the FM.
From what I've played with this tactic, when you lose, you really want to kick the ass of your blind players.
Best taker.
Thanks! That's a lot of goals scored there!