I'm having some inconsistencies with the results, so I'll have to run some things again. Either I screwed up somewhere, or they changed the match engine last patch.
Jimmy said: @ZaZ What do you think about this one ? I just don't know if I should tell my SSs to stay outside and to take the flanks when they/we have the ball on their player instructions. Expand
It's better for the SS to play by the middle instead of going to the flanks.
P.S.: Current match engine has way more variance than previous. I am gonna create a custom test league to improve my tests accuracy.
After some testing, I noticed Red 0.2 was actually worse than Red 0.1. It's just that the first couple of results were too good, possibly outliers due to RNG. I have removed it from the main post to avoid confusion, but it will be here if anyone still want to try it.
pixar said: How likely are IWBs doing better on the opposite foot? I'm almost certain they have a higher tactical aptitude. Expand
Foot of IWB doesn't matter, since they don't shoot or cross. You can safely ignore the opinion of your assistant manager on that, it has no affect on performance.
Jimmy said: @ZaZ When you talked about 1 TF supported by 2 SS performing well… what kind of formation were you talking about ? What about a 3(CBs)-3(WBs+DM)-1(CM)-2(SSs)-1(TF) ? Basically your formation with SS instead of IW and one more CB instead of 1 TF, that allows WB to be a bit higher. Expand
Added Red 0.1. They have almost the same performance, but Red 0.1 is slightly better for stronger team while Red 0.2 is slightly better for weaker team.
Ucan said: and i set their trainings as a AF or shall i change to TF? i changed wingers trainings to inverted winger Expand
Always change training for their roles, so they get maximum tactical familiarity. I also recommend individual training for quickness. They will complain about it, but ignore the complaints. =)
Ucan said: i was using af. tf is better than af ? and i've already bought 2 af strikers they arent like a target player but shall i think same like af ? (you know i changed your blue 3.0 to 2 strikers af and winger version) Expand
It's fine, fast players make better TF than those slow but strong.
avonseller said: Based on your tests so far what's the most suited striker profile for the tactic? You think small and pacey ones will be fine even though by definition that's not what the role is? Expand
Yeah, fast is better. Those TFs don't play like your usual big bad guy that stays on the box all time. They instead will get the ball several times in the middle of the pitch and hold it until CM, wingers and other TF run into space.
I like to follow the philosophy of short-long-wide, meaning whenever a player touches the ball, he should have at least one option for short passing, long passing and someone in the flank giving width. DLP is the one offering short option most of the time in the back, while in the front it's CM and TFs. For long passes, you have all five forward players with run into space. The tactic actually changes from 4132 to 235 when you have possession, allowing you to overwhelm your opponent's defense. Finally, for width, the winger with the ball will cut to the middle while the other winger from the same side (IWB or IW) will run wide. This allows you to put high pressure from every direction, which makes it harder to defend against.
Belmorn said: yes ofc but you stated you do 10 tests or so per day so I was wondering how you doing that atm ? Expand
I just do one big holiday, like you said. If result is not terrible, I run the tactic three times. If at least two of the results are not bad, then I run five times in total. Then, I discard the two best and worse results for points per match and goal difference (which can be from different runs) and use it as my measurement of quality. This score (median) means I expect half of any future runs to be better and half to be worse, having an advantage over doing the average because it discards outliers (which can distort results). Running five holiday runs (from the same save) give me some confidence that my results might be good or bad, for the conditions I am testing.
Belmorn said: How do you test your tactic atm ? I find it hard to draw conclusions on creating a tactic and just do one big holiday. Expand
There is no right answer for that question. Each testing platform has a different methodology and all of them are valid. If you want to test it without going on holiday, you can just play a normal season with the tactic, managing the team, and see how it performs compared to other tactics you have tested before.
Red is a high intensity tactic with very attacking mentality. This is an early post for people that want to use a solid tactic during beta, but performance can change drastically after release, when match engine changes. Description will be updated after game release.
Here are some results and performance of a holiday test with Manchester City and Norwich, predicted 1st and 20th respectively. Tactic was just plugged in and all other decisions were up to assistant manager, including team selection.
Leave a comment below if you liked the tactic and make sure to share your results. Enjoy!
arsenal737 said: Good evening everybody, old timer of this beautiful game here having played zillions of hours right from championship manager as it was called then. Dear ZaZ, I've tried your test tactic you posted last in the forum and guys its the best tactic I've come across on Beta so far. Request everyone to blindly plug and play it. And ZaZ mate you are definitely the numero uno tactic creator I've seen in all these years although you being very down to earth and don't like taking credit, but please do for the work you have created here. I mean really I truly appreciate your tactics especially the last one. Always waiting for your next one, cheers!!! Expand
Thank you so much!
I decided to open my test results this year to help people get better tactics. I understand that might make someone post the same tactic before me and claim credits for it (maybe in another forum or Discord server), but I still think this way is better for everyone. Being in the top of the table is kinda tiresome, because you suddenly become a celebrity with thousands of questions asked every day, even though you are just a player like many others.
Anyway, thank you again for the encouraging words! I'll keep trying to improve the tactic, but everything might disappear once game is released because of new match engine.
BiTeL33T said: any with slower tempo? even rotating my team all the time im getting so many injuries Expand
Probably not gonna have top tactic without maximum intensity. When you lower tempo, you lower you chance to win. You can use it to rest when match is already won, tough.
P.S.: Pass Into Space was one of the worst team instructions I tried. Avoid it like the plague.
I just don't know if I should tell my SSs to stay outside and to take the flanks when they/we have the ball on their player instructions.
It's better for the SS to play by the middle instead of going to the flanks.
P.S.: Current match engine has way more variance than previous. I am gonna create a custom test league to improve my tests accuracy.
Yeah. It went very well in the first two runs, then bad in the later three. I then run a couple more just to be sure, and it was worse.
Chewbacca said: Any results with the tactics?
Running right now. (Don't have a save of the end of season to get the screenshots.)
Foot of IWB doesn't matter, since they don't shoot or cross. You can safely ignore the opinion of your assistant manager on that, it has no affect on performance.
Jimmy said: @ZaZ When you talked about 1 TF supported by 2 SS performing well… what kind of formation were you talking about ?
What about a 3(CBs)-3(WBs+DM)-1(CM)-2(SSs)-1(TF) ? Basically your formation with SS instead of IW and one more CB instead of 1 TF, that allows WB to be a bit higher.
Not sure, I didn't test it.
As long as they are fast, it doesn't matter much what role your scouts or assistant manager thinks they play best.
Sane said: ZaZ, how much percentage of role 2Tf-at is better than roles 2Af-at?
I don't know, might be just 2 or 3 points in the end of a full season.
Always change training for their roles, so they get maximum tactical familiarity. I also recommend individual training for quickness. They will complain about it, but ignore the complaints. =)
It's fine, fast players make better TF than those slow but strong.
Yeah, fast is better. Those TFs don't play like your usual big bad guy that stays on the box all time. They instead will get the ball several times in the middle of the pitch and hold it until CM, wingers and other TF run into space.
I like to follow the philosophy of short-long-wide, meaning whenever a player touches the ball, he should have at least one option for short passing, long passing and someone in the flank giving width. DLP is the one offering short option most of the time in the back, while in the front it's CM and TFs. For long passes, you have all five forward players with run into space. The tactic actually changes from 4132 to 235 when you have possession, allowing you to overwhelm your opponent's defense. Finally, for width, the winger with the ball will cut to the middle while the other winger from the same side (IWB or IW) will run wide. This allows you to put high pressure from every direction, which makes it harder to defend against.
I just do one big holiday, like you said. If result is not terrible, I run the tactic three times. If at least two of the results are not bad, then I run five times in total. Then, I discard the two best and worse results for points per match and goal difference (which can be from different runs) and use it as my measurement of quality. This score (median) means I expect half of any future runs to be better and half to be worse, having an advantage over doing the average because it discards outliers (which can distort results). Running five holiday runs (from the same save) give me some confidence that my results might be good or bad, for the conditions I am testing.
I find it hard to draw conclusions on creating a tactic and just do one big holiday.
There is no right answer for that question. Each testing platform has a different methodology and all of them are valid. If you want to test it without going on holiday, you can just play a normal season with the tactic, managing the team, and see how it performs compared to other tactics you have tested before.
https://fm-arena.com/thread/1630-zaz-red-0-2/
Here are some results and performance of a holiday test with Manchester City and Norwich, predicted 1st and 20th respectively. Tactic was just plugged in and all other decisions were up to assistant manager, including team selection.
Leave a comment below if you liked the tactic and make sure to share your results. Enjoy!
I am using the same schedule from last year, which you can find here: https://fm-arena.com/thread/884-zaz-blue-3-0/
However, keep in mind that I never did any testing with trainings and the ones I use might very well be as good or bad as any other.
Thank you so much!
I decided to open my test results this year to help people get better tactics. I understand that might make someone post the same tactic before me and claim credits for it (maybe in another forum or Discord server), but I still think this way is better for everyone. Being in the top of the table is kinda tiresome, because you suddenly become a celebrity with thousands of questions asked every day, even though you are just a player like many others.
Anyway, thank you again for the encouraging words! I'll keep trying to improve the tactic, but everything might disappear once game is released because of new match engine.
Gonna add to the queue to be tested.
Probably not gonna have top tactic without maximum intensity. When you lower tempo, you lower you chance to win. You can use it to rest when match is already won, tough.
P.S.: Pass Into Space was one of the worst team instructions I tried. Avoid it like the plague.
Found some similar, but no better yet.