Ok. So I used @cptdoggo League of Nations test league. I ran 6 test runs to figure out the strongest teams in the test league and an order of rated teams.
I then took the 8 best tactics from FM Arena, and applied them in reverse order to try and give the league a bit of balance. Unfortunately Germany was unplayable and was the original strongest team. I accidently picked the 9th team of the 10 as the test spot.
Assignment
Next I ran 6 more tests with the assigned tactics to see what it looked like. As expected the top 8 tactics totally dominated with Germany finishing a long way behind in 9th and the test tactic spot of Argentina tailing way behind.
I then tested Mad Dogs V2 as Argentina in the League of Nations Top Tactics test league. It did relatively well but well behind most of the top tactics, only beating Mongoose and finishing 8th with 558 points. In FM Arena rated Mad Dogs V2 4.5, well below the minimum of 5.2 for the top 8 tactics.
Finally I have tested Shaolin 433. It did a little better than Mad Dogs V2 but I still wouldn't rate it higher than some of the top current FM Arena tactics. It finished 7th with 588 points in front of Mongoose and ZaZ Blue DM Tweak.
Interestingly @ZaZ Blue DM and Positive Tiki Taka are killing it in this top tactic league despite having below average teams.
Bottom line is that I am not convinced that the Shaolin 433 tactic is as good as some of the tactics at the top of the table on this site.
ZaZ said: I screwed up somewhere and when I openned my save this morning it was still in match 28 (closed the game without saving). That means I had to replay those lost matches and results have changed. I am not gonna lie, the season might become easier since I won those matches (previously a victory and a draw). There is nothing I can do about that other than apologize and go on with the run. I hope I win the league with a good margin so this doesn't make much of a difference in the end. Expand
This is why I save every couple of days at least in game time so I don't have to replay games. Some perceive it as cheating but I still would rather have the original of what I went through than be replaying games. I still follow with interest you story with this save and have confidence it will take you a long way.
Sometimes these things happens. I have had a few crashes in my time that mostly went the other way. I think the best way to deal with it is, that the stuff you lost was just you dreaming and then you went to the reality and that is what stays.
OK, at the risk of being called for plagiarism, I am posting this. I am unsure on where we landed on such matters. I would be happy to change it if anyone thinks I should. I looked at the mad dogs 41221 V1 posted by @gaohaoqing and it tested pretty well. To be honest I liked the shape but felt the symmetry wasn't quite there. @gaohaoqing says the author is nichudi, who I assume is not on the FM Arena site.
Let me know your thoughts.
I tested the original tactic but moved the DL up to WBL to give it something that looked more aesthetic to me. it tested pretty good. I then added the set piece routine from @ZaZ and wow. This has then become easily the best tactic I have tested this year.
So here is the tactic:
And here are the results in the League of Nations testing league, set up by @cptdoggo:
Just by way of comparison I haven't been able to get a ZaZ tactic to get 130+ for both sides in this league. And this one gets 140 plus for both. Really looking forward to seeing how it tests. I will now start using it in my current saves. Please give it a go and let me know how it goes for you.
I am going to post an updated version of this tactic up separately but will give you all the credit. It tested really well for me but I think the changes make it really good.
OmegaLuke said: Tactic developed during twitch LIVE stream save with PSV that is beating Liverpool, Atletico Madrid and Chelsea in the third season Expand
Here is a link that states what you need to do to get you tactics tested in FM Arena. Please read it and update your post. Thanks
venomenom said: I'm sorry if this seems as a bit of a noob question. So I downloaded genie scout, uploaded the ratings and everything. My question is, how do you find players for specific tactics, for instance yours @ZaZ Expand
I use this view, you can then see the positional ability and positional ratings. You need positional ability above 13 out of 20 and the best positional rating you can afford.
I have added two new versions of Dragons Breathe, version 1.3 and version 4.1. They are based on different structures with the first one Dragons Breath 1.3 being quite close to the original and the second one using the structure of @ZaZ Blue DLP AM. Still quite close structure to my original.
Version 1.3
Version 4.1
Results have been very impressive, see the original post for results and download.
ZaZ said: Now at 30 matches in the league. League is almost won and I'm progressing well on FA Trophy (I usually win that lower cup in first season). Got two longer injuries (longest lasting three months), so I recalled two players from loan. I don't plan to renew contract with any of my players, as it's often better to just hire a new team after season is over. Since all players are pretty bad, you get interest of better players (even free agents) after your team increases reputation.
As a funny fact, I got a bug where half of my team played in black uniform, so it seemed as if three teams were in the field. Picture attached.
Expand
I had one player like that in one of my games. I am pretty sure it was a reserve when he came on.
ZaZ said: Last matches were a breeze. Four victories and one tie in the league, three victories against weak teams in the cup. Because of rewards, financial balance is finally positive. Important to see my defender scoring four times in two matches, from corners. In one of those matches, the two goals happened in less than one minute, just like a replay. That makes six goals from corners in ten matches (and another goal in the cup). My corner routine is set to near post. No wonder he is again the best player from last five matches.
By the way, I didn't say it earlier, but it's only possible to run a squad of eleven players because my team is semi-professional, so training is very light. With that, they get less injuries and recover way faster (but barely improve). My training schedule is shown below.
I would also like to talk about my squad view. It's basically divided in the following parts: - Selection info, including condition, sharpness, fatigue and injury risk, as well as games missed in a row (everyone is tired because I took the shot right after a match). - Morale, form, last match rating and training rating, to remind me to praise those with ratings over 8.0 in any of those ratings to increase morale. - Role training and additional focus, because I always forget to set those things when I hire new players. - Other important info like goals, assists, important attributes and salary.
I would advise anyone to have at least fatigue and games missed in a row visible at team selection, to help rotating the team better.
Let me know your thoughts! Expand
Can you upload the squad view for us so we don't have to recreate it - Thanks
I save my game at least two or three times a week in game time as I have previously lost saves due to power outages or PC crashes. So my saves for a season would be much higher than 79. I don't cheat in my game saves so I think it doesn't necessarily follow that a lot of game saves equals cheating. And as @ZaZ said it is largely irrelevant as all that really counts is the result of the test on this site.
Mnj said: Thank you ZaZ and Mark for all your work! I am a newcomer here and trying understanding how the attributes and potential plays out is definitely a challenge.
I already downloaded Mark's filter and I would like to compare them with yours ZaZ but the WeTransfer link expired I would be very grateful if you could upload it again. I am playing mostly in lower league so it may be better to find cheap players.
I was also wondering if you guys ever tried playing with negative percentages in the Genie rating for the expensive attributes with little effects? I vaguely remember that negative percentages worked in previous versions but I am not sure. Expand
I cant say I have ever tried using negative percentages.
Well it is good to see this tactic test a bit better in the new test league and updated match engine.
I have started successfully and have been using a suite of 3 of my tactics in lower leagues with the new match engine. Running my normally 3 sides in different countries. This year going for really low leagues using databases from FM Scout.
I am playing O'Connor Knights in the Canberra Premier League in Australia, Tier 4 of the Australia Full Pyramid database by Weiry which has promotion and relegation the whole way up. I took over mid season when they were under performing and so far unbeaten and into the top half which just meets the Boards expectations.
Tyreso FF (a nod to TFF the great tactician) in Swedish Second Division South Svealand League is my second team. I took over when they were last after 9 of 28 rounds on 5 points. now out of relegation zone with a 3-1 win and a 4-0 win. No new database required to play this one. Just need to stay up so I can try and get promoted next season. I was expected to fight bravely against relegation. And if I don't, this manager will be out of a job as I don't think there is a playable league below this.
Last side is Glasgow United in Scotland, in the West of Scotland Conference B League. This is the 7th tier using the FM22 Scotland Lower Leagues Full Scottish Pyramid by Mozza. Only in preseason so far. Glasgow United are predicted to finish 11th of 15 so I will need to at least meet that to stay away from relegation. I cant see any of these getting promotion this season but I am playing the long game. I need to keep reading Sir Alex Ferguson's approach to planning long term and keeping players happy.
I decided against Brexit this year so went away from the England and moved to Scotland. In the lower leagues having Brexit limits the players you can access after the first year. Started with the Scottish preseason at 5 July hence coming in halfway through Sweden and Australia. I haven't had much in the way of buying players as all these clubs have little or no money and low expectations in their leagues. I have lost one player across the 3 sides and bought in 2 players. I used my Genie Scout Ratings and got 2 good DCs for the leagues I am in.
When I looked at the ratings for my tactics, prior to Dragons Den being tested, I noticed that Dragons Breath was in the top 10 for goal difference and Dragons Breath 3.1 was leading the goals scored for this match engine. Under the original FM22 FM Arena testing Dragons Den had the best defence of my tactics so I went with Dragons Breath as my main tactic, Dragons Breath 3.1 to attack and score goals and Dragons Den to close out games.
Now we have Dragons Den tested with the new match engine I wont be changing my approach. Dragons Breath is equal 8th on goal difference, Dragons Breath 3.1 leads the most goals scored and Dragons Den is 11th for best defence, and also saves the energy of players. The other nice thing about using these 3 tactics is that they are easy to move between as the base structures are quite similar. To move from the main tactic to the attacking one the CM Attack moves to ST AF. To move from the main tactic to defensive the ST F9 moves back to AM SS. To move between Attacking and Defensive is a little more with ST AF moving back to CM Attack and ST F9 back to AM SS. Late in the game this isn't a big issue though.
Combine this approach with a decent training regime, @ZaZ morale approach and shouts and a decent scout process and the game doesn't seem that hard at the moment, I sure there will be some rocky times but having the confidence in the system certainly helps. I will post again a bit further down the track. I am definitely having fun at the moment and hope to take these clubs far with this save. Money will be the first big issue though. There isn't much around with any of these clubs. And it will be a long time before they start competing for the same players.
Already there is a large discrepancy between their abilities. I thought these clubs would be quite close in terms of ability but it is not the case. And there is a large spread between players abilities in each of the 3 clubs. I hope to be able to buy in more capable players as we lose the fear of relegation and get the Boards to see we have a bright future in moving up the leagues.
I have also redone my assessment of attributes that can be be improved for each position through training for this year. And the winners are (drum roll please):
These are in order. You should check each of your players to see where the best improvements can be made and then set their individual training focus. These attributes are not always easily identifiable. In individual training focus they are sometimes hidden eg Decisions for a DC is Defensive Positioning. Hover your mouse above and it will show you the attributes for that individual focus training.
This is based on the cost and importance of each attribute. I am not convinced about the Acc for GKs but time will tell.
I then took the 8 best tactics from FM Arena, and applied them in reverse order to try and give the league a bit of balance. Unfortunately Germany was unplayable and was the original strongest team. I accidently picked the 9th team of the 10 as the test spot.
Assignment
Next I ran 6 more tests with the assigned tactics to see what it looked like. As expected the top 8 tactics totally dominated with Germany finishing a long way behind in 9th and the test tactic spot of Argentina tailing way behind.
I then tested Mad Dogs V2 as Argentina in the League of Nations Top Tactics test league. It did relatively well but well behind most of the top tactics, only beating Mongoose and finishing 8th with 558 points. In FM Arena rated Mad Dogs V2 4.5, well below the minimum of 5.2 for the top 8 tactics.
Finally I have tested Shaolin 433. It did a little better than Mad Dogs V2 but I still wouldn't rate it higher than some of the top current FM Arena tactics. It finished 7th with 588 points in front of Mongoose and ZaZ Blue DM Tweak.
Interestingly @ZaZ Blue DM and Positive Tiki Taka are killing it in this top tactic league despite having below average teams.
Bottom line is that I am not convinced that the Shaolin 433 tactic is as good as some of the tactics at the top of the table on this site.
This is why I save every couple of days at least in game time so I don't have to replay games. Some perceive it as cheating but I still would rather have the original of what I went through than be replaying games. I still follow with interest you story with this save and have confidence it will take you a long way.
Sometimes these things happens. I have had a few crashes in my time that mostly went the other way. I think the best way to deal with it is, that the stuff you lost was just you dreaming and then you went to the reality and that is what stays.
Let me know your thoughts.
I tested the original tactic but moved the DL up to WBL to give it something that looked more aesthetic to me. it tested pretty good. I then added the set piece routine from @ZaZ and wow. This has then become easily the best tactic I have tested this year.
So here is the tactic:
And here are the results in the League of Nations testing league, set up by @cptdoggo:
Just by way of comparison I haven't been able to get a ZaZ tactic to get 130+ for both sides in this league. And this one gets 140 plus for both. Really looking forward to seeing how it tests. I will now start using it in my current saves. Please give it a go and let me know how it goes for you.
I am going to post an updated version of this tactic up separately but will give you all the credit. It tested really well for me but I think the changes make it really good.
You will also need screenshots of results - see the link below:
Tactic Testing Requirements
Here is a link that states what you need to do to get you tactics tested in FM Arena. Please read it and update your post. Thanks
Requirements to get tactics tested
I use this view, you can then see the positional ability and positional ratings. You need positional ability above 13 out of 20 and the best positional rating you can afford.
Version 1.3
Version 4.1
Results have been very impressive, see the original post for results and download.
As a funny fact, I got a bug where half of my team played in black uniform, so it seemed as if three teams were in the field. Picture attached.
I had one player like that in one of my games. I am pretty sure it was a reserve when he came on.
By the way, I didn't say it earlier, but it's only possible to run a squad of eleven players because my team is semi-professional, so training is very light. With that, they get less injuries and recover way faster (but barely improve). My training schedule is shown below.
I would also like to talk about my squad view. It's basically divided in the following parts:
- Selection info, including condition, sharpness, fatigue and injury risk, as well as games missed in a row (everyone is tired because I took the shot right after a match).
- Morale, form, last match rating and training rating, to remind me to praise those with ratings over 8.0 in any of those ratings to increase morale.
- Role training and additional focus, because I always forget to set those things when I hire new players.
- Other important info like goals, assists, important attributes and salary.
I would advise anyone to have at least fatigue and games missed in a row visible at team selection, to help rotating the team better.
Let me know your thoughts!
Can you upload the squad view for us so we don't have to recreate it - Thanks
I already downloaded Mark's filter and I would like to compare them with yours ZaZ but the WeTransfer link expired I would be very grateful if you could upload it again. I am playing mostly in lower league so it may be better to find cheap players.
I was also wondering if you guys ever tried playing with negative percentages in the Genie rating for the expensive attributes with little effects? I vaguely remember that negative percentages worked in previous versions but I am not sure.
I cant say I have ever tried using negative percentages.
I have started successfully and have been using a suite of 3 of my tactics in lower leagues with the new match engine. Running my normally 3 sides in different countries. This year going for really low leagues using databases from FM Scout.
I am playing O'Connor Knights in the Canberra Premier League in Australia, Tier 4 of the Australia Full Pyramid database by Weiry which has promotion and relegation the whole way up. I took over mid season when they were under performing and so far unbeaten and into the top half which just meets the Boards expectations.
Tyreso FF (a nod to TFF the great tactician) in Swedish Second Division South Svealand League is my second team. I took over when they were last after 9 of 28 rounds on 5 points. now out of relegation zone with a 3-1 win and a 4-0 win. No new database required to play this one. Just need to stay up so I can try and get promoted next season. I was expected to fight bravely against relegation. And if I don't, this manager will be out of a job as I don't think there is a playable league below this.
Last side is Glasgow United in Scotland, in the West of Scotland Conference B League. This is the 7th tier using the FM22 Scotland Lower Leagues Full Scottish Pyramid by Mozza. Only in preseason so far. Glasgow United are predicted to finish 11th of 15 so I will need to at least meet that to stay away from relegation. I cant see any of these getting promotion this season but I am playing the long game. I need to keep reading Sir Alex Ferguson's approach to planning long term and keeping players happy.
I decided against Brexit this year so went away from the England and moved to Scotland. In the lower leagues having Brexit limits the players you can access after the first year. Started with the Scottish preseason at 5 July hence coming in halfway through Sweden and Australia. I haven't had much in the way of buying players as all these clubs have little or no money and low expectations in their leagues. I have lost one player across the 3 sides and bought in 2 players. I used my Genie Scout Ratings and got 2 good DCs for the leagues I am in.
When I looked at the ratings for my tactics, prior to Dragons Den being tested, I noticed that Dragons Breath was in the top 10 for goal difference and Dragons Breath 3.1 was leading the goals scored for this match engine. Under the original FM22 FM Arena testing Dragons Den had the best defence of my tactics so I went with Dragons Breath as my main tactic, Dragons Breath 3.1 to attack and score goals and Dragons Den to close out games.
Now we have Dragons Den tested with the new match engine I wont be changing my approach. Dragons Breath is equal 8th on goal difference, Dragons Breath 3.1 leads the most goals scored and Dragons Den is 11th for best defence, and also saves the energy of players. The other nice thing about using these 3 tactics is that they are easy to move between as the base structures are quite similar. To move from the main tactic to the attacking one the CM Attack moves to ST AF. To move from the main tactic to defensive the ST F9 moves back to AM SS. To move between Attacking and Defensive is a little more with ST AF moving back to CM Attack and ST F9 back to AM SS. Late in the game this isn't a big issue though.
Combine this approach with a decent training regime, @ZaZ morale approach and shouts and a decent scout process and the game doesn't seem that hard at the moment, I sure there will be some rocky times but having the confidence in the system certainly helps. I will post again a bit further down the track. I am definitely having fun at the moment and hope to take these clubs far with this save. Money will be the first big issue though. There isn't much around with any of these clubs. And it will be a long time before they start competing for the same players.
Already there is a large discrepancy between their abilities. I thought these clubs would be quite close in terms of ability but it is not the case. And there is a large spread between players abilities in each of the 3 clubs. I hope to be able to buy in more capable players as we lose the fear of relegation and get the Boards to see we have a bright future in moving up the leagues.
what is the difference between 2 table ?
ta2199 said: same question
Read the opening post. I think that is all we will get.
Here is my copy of the original default ratings file mate
Default Ratings File
These are in order. You should check each of your players to see where the best improvements can be made and then set their individual training focus. These attributes are not always easily identifiable. In individual training focus they are sometimes hidden eg Decisions for a DC is Defensive Positioning. Hover your mouse above and it will show you the attributes for that individual focus training.
This is based on the cost and importance of each attribute. I am not convinced about the Acc for GKs but time will tell.