Nikko said: even if you remove some crazy formations like only 1 defender and so on and leave only about 40 formations that can be considered as the most reliable formation then you still have like 60,466,176 different tactics to test and to get this number I took into consideration only the duties and roles but if I would considered the Team Instruction and Set Piece then I can only image how many additional zeros that number would get Expand Yeah... obviously, as I said if you want your tactic testing were useful then the only way to achieve that is analyzing its result and fiddling patters because a blind testing of random tactics is a complete waste of time.
For example, if you look at the Passing Directness slider then you'll see it has 5 levels
We've tested many different tactics with the Passing Direction slider set at the lowest level and the highest level and the difference was about 5% at the best.
Can you imagen how little difference it makes when you adjust the slider only by one notch? But from my experience it isn't a rare thing to see people adjust the Passing Direction slider only by one notch and ask to test their tactics again saying that such change turns their tactics into world-beaters.
To say honestly, this tactic doesn't bring anything that's really new to the table but since it's been getting some attention from the community ( at least few people shared their results ) we've given it a go.
I've been noticing there're some discussions going on the topic so I'd like to briefly explain the reason why the tactic testing slows down toward the end of each cycle.
First of all, here are some numbers:
There're about 1,144,066 possible formation variations in the game and if we look at the positions then every position has up to 3 duties and up to 8 roles. That gives us about 1,000,000,000,000,000 possible different tactic variations.
Also, every tactic might have up to 100 different Team Instructions and that further increases the number of possible tactic variations to some crazy number like 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 or even more if take into consideration Set Pieces and Individual Player Instructions.
So to test all possible tactic variations it would required running a extreme high-end PC non-stop 24 hours per day for 6,000,000,0000,000,000 days.
As you can see any attempt to brute-force cracking the Match Engine by testing all possible tactic variations would be an absurd idea and that's why when we pick tactics for the testing we use some algorithm that helps us to filter tactics in order to exclude those tactics that are very similar to what's been tested already. Also, at this point our algorithm has learned very well the impact of different Team Instructions/Roles/Duties and it helps to avoid testing something that in theory would make a very small difference like 1%-5% or even smaller.
At this point we're gonna test a tactic only if we see that it offers "really" something new and it's also backed up with outstanding results and feedbacks by many different people.
alexej said: Are we going to get a new section on the tactic testing page even though the changes to match engine are minor? Expand
We're going to retest few tactics internally and see whether the match engine changes are significant enough to start retesting all the tactics for 22.3 patch.
fm arena user said: Thanks i didnt see this thred before. Which atributes should AM have to give touchline instructions Motivation? Tactical knowladge? Expand
I just want to add that if you're going to handle the Shouts yourself then it's always more beneficial releasing Shouts to "Entire Team" instead of "Individuals" because it affects all the players at once.
"Fired up be the feedback" body language means that you released a proper shout that motivated your players.
If you're going to delegate the Shouts to your assistant manager then to do well he should have high "Motivating", "People Management", "Tactical Knowledge" and "Determination". Also, if these attributes are at a high level then he'll be very good in doing the Team Talks.
fm arena user said: Zaz do You belive that shouts during matches are usefull at all? Do You using any Yourself? Expand
I can say that we've tested the Touchline Instructions and found that they are essential and give a huge advantage.
It requires releasing Touchline Instructions every 15-20 minutes during a match which can be quite annoying so if you don't want to be bothered with doing them then you can delegate them to your assistant manager.
I just want to let you know that after some consideration we've decided not to retest tactics only because of the new fm-arena set pieces and the reason for this decision being that we're just a few weeks or so away from a new patch that also highly likely will require retesting the tactics so there's no point in doing any retesting right now.
MrGreen said: Why does this only work if you have those specified roles? Expand
Long story short, in some set pieces you can make players to take some specific positions by using some specific instructions and that specific positions are tied up with their positions and duties in the tactic.
Btw, I changed the thread name, having a word "exploit" in it was a bit misleading, the new name reflects better what this is about.
Yeah... obviously, as I said if you want your tactic testing were useful then the only way to achieve that is analyzing its result and fiddling patters because a blind testing of random tactics is a complete waste of time.
For example, if you look at the Passing Directness slider then you'll see it has 5 levels
We've tested many different tactics with the Passing Direction slider set at the lowest level and the highest level and the difference was about 5% at the best.
Can you imagen how little difference it makes when you adjust the slider only by one notch? But from my experience it isn't a rare thing to see people adjust the Passing Direction slider only by one notch and ask to test their tactics again saying that such change turns their tactics into world-beaters.
https://fm-arena.com/tactic/2909-433-haaland-narrow-rip/
I've been noticing there're some discussions going on the topic so I'd like to briefly explain the reason why the tactic testing slows down toward the end of each cycle.
First of all, here are some numbers:
There're about 1,144,066 possible formation variations in the game and if we look at the positions then every position has up to 3 duties and up to 8 roles. That gives us about 1,000,000,000,000,000 possible different tactic variations.
Also, every tactic might have up to 100 different Team Instructions and that further increases the number of possible tactic variations to some crazy number like 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 or even more if take into consideration Set Pieces and Individual Player Instructions.
So to test all possible tactic variations it would required running a extreme high-end PC non-stop 24 hours per day for 6,000,000,0000,000,000 days.
As you can see any attempt to brute-force cracking the Match Engine by testing all possible tactic variations would be an absurd idea and that's why when we pick tactics for the testing we use some algorithm that helps us to filter tactics in order to exclude those tactics that are very similar to what's been tested already. Also, at this point our algorithm has learned very well the impact of different Team Instructions/Roles/Duties and it helps to avoid testing something that in theory would make a very small difference like 1%-5% or even smaller.
At this point we're gonna test a tactic only if we see that it offers "really" something new and it's also backed up with outstanding results and feedbacks by many different people.
I hope this clears the situation a bit.
Cheers.
Honestly, it's pretty much what has been said already in this thread and some other threads. I really don't have anything important to add to that.
Hi,
I've edited the post. Please note, only constructive criticism is welcome here.
Thanks.
Hi,
I've edited the post. Please note, only constructive criticism is welcome here.
Thanks.
The thread name and description must be in English.
Thanks.
Please, also add a screenshot of the league table at the end of the season and a screenshot of the team media prediction before the season.
Thank you.
You should post your own result with the tactic.
Thank you.
You should post your own result with the tactic.
Thank you.
Please, post full season result.
Thank you.
Please, post any result with the tactic from "normal" game.
Thank you.
We're going to retest few tactics internally and see whether the match engine changes are significant enough to start retesting all the tactics for 22.3 patch.
Which atributes should AM have to give touchline instructions Motivation? Tactical knowladge?
I just want to add that if you're going to handle the Shouts yourself then it's always more beneficial releasing Shouts to "Entire Team" instead of "Individuals" because it affects all the players at once.
"Fired up be the feedback" body language means that you released a proper shout that motivated your players.
If you're going to delegate the Shouts to your assistant manager then to do well he should have high "Motivating", "People Management", "Tactical Knowledge" and "Determination". Also, if these attributes are at a high level then he'll be very good in doing the Team Talks.
I can say that we've tested the Touchline Instructions and found that they are essential and give a huge advantage.
It requires releasing Touchline Instructions every 15-20 minutes during a match which can be quite annoying so if you don't want to be bothered with doing them then you can delegate them to your assistant manager.
More info - https://fm-arena.com/thread/628-touchline-shouts-in-fm21/
Please note, only English language is allowed here.
If you want to speak with your friends using your native language then you can use private messages for it.
Thank you.
Fixed. Try to remove it now.
I just want to let you know that after some consideration we've decided not to retest tactics only because of the new fm-arena set pieces and the reason for this decision being that we're just a few weeks or so away from a new patch that also highly likely will require retesting the tactics so there's no point in doing any retesting right now.
Cheers.
Long story short, in some set pieces you can make players to take some specific positions by using some specific instructions and that specific positions are tied up with their positions and duties in the tactic.
Btw, I changed the thread name, having a word "exploit" in it was a bit misleading, the new name reflects better what this is about.
I hope that helps.
Cheers.