For what it is worth both ykykyky and MDW22 rate Odrizola as the better of the two assuming their DR positional ratings are both 20/20. Calculating them manually using ykykyky I have Odrizola 78.77% and Wembangomo 75.75%, and using MDW22 I make it Odrizola 78.60% and Wembangomo 73.73%.
This tactic owes a lot to the RedGen tactic by @CSTG KANE. I thought I would try and transform it into a 343 asymmetrical tactic. Unfortunately I forgot to change the name so it still says 424.
I moved one of the ST back to AM Att, the right winger back to MR IW Sup and the left back up to WB WB Att. To cover for the loss of a defender I placed one of the DMs to DM Def in the hope that he would cover when the WB went forward. I changed the other DM to Vol Su to try and get more attacking chances.
I used my normal testing teams. Highlights were Man City going close to winning everything and scoring 117 goals and 103 points. Missed out on CL by going down to PSG in the semi.
Even Bromley scored 132 goals and 111 points in the VNL.
Defensively seemed ok as well but not as good as RedGeneral.
Just in case you missed it, the Newgan guys have issued an update to Newgan Manager that fixes the "r-" issue and a few more.
If you are interested there are two videos that will help you install the update. Priisek has one and Zealand's old video on how to update and not lose you Newgan profiles.
You are not listening mate. Have a look at the best tactics that have been tested and make sure you have the same screenshots as them in the opening post. For example, all the results for a season, all the player stats for the season including goals and assists and how many matches played.
NandaldiaN said: @Mark this is so interesting, i started using your table with tactics yesterday, and i must say its working pretty good. Munchen 1860 no transfers. Winning every match. Im using analyst report to see what formations work against the opponent if their tactic is not 433/4321/532. But would love to have a better table against more formations Expand
I have been working on ways of doing this. It might take a bit of time though
crazyfmguy93 said: For lower leagues MDW22 and ykykyk is difference a lot. When I change calculations they recommend different players for positons in FM23. It is confusing. Expand
You don't have all the right screenshots. Have a look at the best tactics that have been tested and make sure you have the same screenshots as them in the opening post. For example, all the results for a season, all the player stats for the season including goals and assists and how many matches played.
Because I've checked our DB and here's what I got:
Red General 4231 v1.0
424 CF Cabuloso
433 Tsukyomi I
According to your table, "Red General 4231 v1.0" tactic is ranked "8th" and "424 CF Cabuloso" tactic is ranked "1st" when it come to 4-3-3 formation but according to our numbers the difference is about 1.5 points which could be just "statistical noise".
If you ask me then I think it makes sense to "rank" tactics only when there's a meaningful difference between them, I'd say it should be at least 10-15 points difference but when the difference is just 1-2 points then it can be easily "statistical noise".
Also, according to your table "433 Tsukyomi I" tactic is ranked "1st" when it comes to 5-3-2 formation but that's not true. Expand
Thanks for you feedback, as always I appreciate it. I accept some of your commentary. There was a minor error in my calculation Which I have now fixed. I have also moved the scale back to the 38 games that you guys use. I have checked the calculation and I still calculate Tsukyomi as ranked first. As I said, I only used the first 6 tests, so is your data showing the average from all tests where you have tested 4000 matches or only the first 2400 matches?
I accept the statistical noise for less than 2 points. I was just trying to look at how I can use a combination of tactics through the season to my advantage.
So here are my results from the first 3 games of the new season. We are expected to be mid table.
Genie Scout Team Ratings and Odds for the season.
Game 1 we are playing against a 433 side who are slight favourites. I think this formation is slightly weaker in defence so I went with Deformation as it is most attacking of the formations that work against 433. We led 2 Nil and hit the woodwork 3 times so we probably should have won by more.
Game 2 up against a 442, with us slight favourites. Tossed up between 424 and 4231. Ended up with the 424 CF Cabuloso because of its defensive advantage. We went down a goal but had a huge win.
Game 3 against 442 Diamond, with us again very slight favourites. I went with the 433 Tsukyomi I. We totally outplayed them but led 2 to 1 when they scored against the run of play. Scored another 2 quick goals to lead 4 to 1 and then swapped to 424 to shut the game down and scored twice late to smash them.
Does this approach work. Still too early to say but seems promising.
dzek said: I think this is a good test and so we will know which formation performs better against the 3 formations used by the FM-Arena tactic testing league. This would be even better if we tested it on the other formations that the game has too.
For the AI formations that haven't been tested by FM Arena I am using the reverse approach eg if I play against a 442 diamond I look at the worst result for the only HOF 442 diamond and go for the worst performance against it by the AI formation. In this case either 523 or 433. So I will play with the 433 Tsukyomi I as my squad is better suited to this formation than a 523.
If I was playing against a 4222 or 424 I would use a 4231.
I hope this makes sense.
What would be more interesting would be a home and away split.
I have had a quick look at the top FM Arena HOF tactics against the 3 formations FM Arena are testing against, 433, 4231 and 523.
I have only looked at standard type tactics with only one asymmetric tactic being the most successful, Deformation II. Because the testing uses 2 of each of 433 and 4231, and only one 523, I have averaged the scores for all tactics to make the 523 comparable. I also only looked at the first 6 tests (ie 2400 matches) for each HOF tactic to ensure they were also all comparable.
The selected tactics were:
4231 RedGeneral v1.0 424 CF Cabuloso 424 BBW v4 424 Deformation II 4222 Jigen Box I 41212 Ol Reliable 343 Italian KO 433 Tsukyomi I 433 Inverted Samba Shield X3 442 BOBW x Scunny v1
I have listed the average points per season and then the ranking against each AI formation.
I have no idea if this will help anyone but I have just started using it.
Please let me know your thoughts and any results if you use it
This is very much based on @A Smile Icebreaker CF II tactic. I have dropped the wing line back to a 442 instead of 424 and used inverted wingers.
Tested with two teams in 3 leagues. All did well, but as I play lower leagues I am just showing VNL. Bromley and Kidderminister both performed well above expectations with some great wins through the season. Being knocked out by Man Utd in the FA Cup was also a massive financial boost for the club.
Given the worst tactic I could come up with had all the players on the outside, I thought I would try all players on the inside, as much as I could. After several attempts I got to one that seems to work. I would probably drop the mentality back to Balanced for away games though or change the Vol Su to DM De as it was a bit weaker away from home.
Something a bit different to all the 4231 tactics around. I wanted to limit Defending players to 3 and have 4 on Attack to try and outscore opponents.
I really don't think I can help. Make sure you have the latest versions. Zealand and Priisek both have videos on it and there is a support section on the FM Base site.
I moved one of the ST back to AM Att, the right winger back to MR IW Sup and the left back up to WB WB Att. To cover for the loss of a defender I placed one of the DMs to DM Def in the hope that he would cover when the WB went forward. I changed the other DM to Vol Su to try and get more attacking chances.
I used my normal testing teams. Highlights were Man City going close to winning everything and scoring 117 goals and 103 points. Missed out on CL by going down to PSG in the semi.
Even Bromley scored 132 goals and 111 points in the VNL.
Defensively seemed ok as well but not as good as RedGeneral.
Please let me know your thoughts.
Man City
Bromley
If you are interested there are two videos that will help you install the update. Priisek has one and Zealand's old video on how to update and not lose you Newgan profiles.
Priisek
Priisek on Newgan Update and how to install
Zealand
Zealand on keeping your Newgan profile when upgrading Newgan Manager
You are not listening mate. Have a look at the best tactics that have been tested and make sure you have the same screenshots as them in the opening post. For example, all the results for a season, all the player stats for the season including goals and assists and how many matches played.
I have been working on ways of doing this. It might take a bit of time though
Yep they are different.
Player stats aren't there
Are you sure your numbers are correct?
Because I've checked our DB and here's what I got:
Red General 4231 v1.0
424 CF Cabuloso
433 Tsukyomi I
According to your table, "Red General 4231 v1.0" tactic is ranked "8th" and "424 CF Cabuloso" tactic is ranked "1st" when it come to 4-3-3 formation but according to our numbers the difference is about 1.5 points which could be just "statistical noise".
If you ask me then I think it makes sense to "rank" tactics only when there's a meaningful difference between them, I'd say it should be at least 10-15 points difference but when the difference is just 1-2 points then it can be easily "statistical noise".
Also, according to your table "433 Tsukyomi I" tactic is ranked "1st" when it comes to 5-3-2 formation but that's not true.
Thanks for you feedback, as always I appreciate it. I accept some of your commentary. There was a minor error in my calculation Which I have now fixed. I have also moved the scale back to the 38 games that you guys use. I have checked the calculation and I still calculate Tsukyomi as ranked first. As I said, I only used the first 6 tests, so is your data showing the average from all tests where you have tested 4000 matches or only the first 2400 matches?
I accept the statistical noise for less than 2 points. I was just trying to look at how I can use a combination of tactics through the season to my advantage.
do you use MDW22 or ykykyk files in genie scout 23? or are there any rating file fit better for 23?
Both are good. I have been using my MDW22 and still am
Genie Scout Team Ratings and Odds for the season.
Game 1 we are playing against a 433 side who are slight favourites. I think this formation is slightly weaker in defence so I went with Deformation as it is most attacking of the formations that work against 433. We led 2 Nil and hit the woodwork 3 times so we probably should have won by more.
Game 2 up against a 442, with us slight favourites. Tossed up between 424 and 4231. Ended up with the 424 CF Cabuloso because of its defensive advantage. We went down a goal but had a huge win.
Game 3 against 442 Diamond, with us again very slight favourites. I went with the 433 Tsukyomi I. We totally outplayed them but led 2 to 1 when they scored against the run of play. Scored another 2 quick goals to lead 4 to 1 and then swapped to 424 to shut the game down and scored twice late to smash them.
Does this approach work. Still too early to say but seems promising.
Good idea @Mark!
For the AI formations that haven't been tested by FM Arena I am using the reverse approach eg if I play against a 442 diamond I look at the worst result for the only HOF 442 diamond and go for the worst performance against it by the AI formation. In this case either 523 or 433. So I will play with the 433 Tsukyomi I as my squad is better suited to this formation than a 523.
If I was playing against a 4222 or 424 I would use a 4231.
I hope this makes sense.
What would be more interesting would be a home and away split.
That is correct
I have only looked at standard type tactics with only one asymmetric tactic being the most successful, Deformation II. Because the testing uses 2 of each of 433 and 4231, and only one 523, I have averaged the scores for all tactics to make the 523 comparable. I also only looked at the first 6 tests (ie 2400 matches) for each HOF tactic to ensure they were also all comparable.
The selected tactics were:
4231 RedGeneral v1.0
424 CF Cabuloso
424 BBW v4
424 Deformation II
4222 Jigen Box I
41212 Ol Reliable
343 Italian KO
433 Tsukyomi I
433 Inverted Samba Shield X3
442 BOBW x Scunny v1
I have listed the average points per season and then the ranking against each AI formation.
I have no idea if this will help anyone but I have just started using it.
Please let me know your thoughts and any results if you use it
Tested with two teams in 3 leagues. All did well, but as I play lower leagues I am just showing VNL. Bromley and Kidderminister both performed well above expectations with some great wins through the season. Being knocked out by Man Utd in the FA Cup was also a massive financial boost for the club.
What does good look like in FM 24?
FM Stag Stats are now in a few Skins including SAS24.
I hope this helps someone. I find it quite interesting
Something a bit different to all the 4231 tactics around. I wanted to limit Defending players to 3 and have 4 on Attack to try and outscore opponents.
Results are below.